#182 How to Stop Yelling At Your Kids (Because You're Traumatizing Them)

Rachel Denning (00:10.99)
Hey you, welcome to this episode. Today we're gonna get a little bit serious and Greg even sheds a few tears, but we're gonna discuss yelling at your children. People are people no matter how small. Your children are people and when you yell at them consistently and in anger, you're traumatizing them. How dare you treat a precious being in your care with such contempt? Stop it. You're the adult. Learn to act like it.

They deserve your love and respect. Despite this harsh and straightforward statement, we are actually very empathetic to the stress and overwhelm parents are facing. We do know that children can be annoying and can push all your buttons. We know that you're exhausted, depleted, unsupported, and pulled in every direction. But ultimately, while yelling might work in the short term, it damages relationships and children in the long term. Yelling means you've reached your wit's end.

have run out of parenting skills, and don't have a close enough attachment with the child you're yelling at. Listen to this episode to learn how to fix all of it and learn how to never yell in anger again. Watch how doing this will drastically change your family culture and parent -child relationships.

This episode is sponsored by our Preventing Problems and Creating Peace Workshop. Learn how to spend more time helping things go right instead of fixing what's going wrong and yelling about it. This workshop will help you to understand Maslow's hierarchy of needs and how to apply it in your family to have fewer or no tantrums, better behavior and more cooperation and greater peace. We'll also outline the pyramid of peace and how to help your kids be self -motivated. If you would like to have more peace at home,

and less yelling, then you need this workshop. Click the link in the show notes and start today implementing these simple strategies to help more things go right at home. Or you can also get this workshop as part of our parenting bundle, which also includes our Extraordinary Parent Mentoring course, teaching children how to manage their emotions workshop, and the Five Habits of Successful Families, which is a self -paced class. Visit ExtraordinaryFamilyLife .com and click the parenting link in the menu.

Rachel Denning (02:43.214)
Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of the Extraordinary Family Life podcast. I kind of feel like starting with a bang today. But maybe I'll start with a... A boom. A what? A boom? I don't know. Where'd that come from? I have no idea. A bang or a boom. A boom. We're going to talk about yelling at your children. And...

Rachel Denning (03:12.846)
I thought it would be funny if I yelled at you to stop yelling at your children. But that's the irony. Because we do the same thing, right? Not we, me and Rachel. We don't yell anymore, really. But we as parents, our kids will be fighting or yelling at each other. And we're like, hey, kids, stop yelling at each other right now. Or they hit each other. And you're like, if you don't stop hitting, I'm going to spank you. And they're like, well, yeah, that's right where I learned to yell and hit.

And so it's interesting, right? You start out, well, man, many of us got married so young, we're practically kids ourselves. And I was, right? And we didn't, most of us were not taught effectively how to even process our own stuff, our own junk and stuff and things. And so we're still carrying around all these things subconsciously or.

consciously. We have all of our own stuff we're dealing with. And then we go and have children. And they're so cute, fortunately, but they're exhausting. And sometimes irritating. Oh yeah, absolutely. And demanding. And challenging. I remember when we adopted Kaya. So Rachel, I've been married like a year and a half.

and we were getting used to each other. I mean, I think you and I had some advantages going in because we both were, you know, you guys know our story. Like Rachel had been engaged and broke off the engagement and really got more clarity about the kind of guy she wanted to date and the kind of marriage. And I had grown up in a family where there was multiple marriages and divorces. And then I was out on my own and I saw the domestic violence and just the rotten junk. And I got to live with all kinds of different families. And...

see what worked and what didn't. And so I had this, I had a clear idea. I started making a list at 16 of all the qualities I wanted in my wife and the qualities I wanted in marriage. And I did a lot of personal work on me as a teenager and as a young adult before I met Rachel. Like I was processing all kinds of stuff. I was really working hard. I had seen firsthand the disaster zone that can happen in families. So man, I was adamant.

Rachel Denning (05:34.062)
And you had clarity and I had clarity. So we got married and we had, I think we had some real big advantages because things were good for us. Really, really good for us. And then, and I tell that kind of just telling the story because then we adopted Kaia and there's this really funny moment because we, every Sunday afternoon we would take naps. Like we would go to our church service and then we come home and we would just take a nap.

And oh, it was the best. And these these just peaceful, peaceful Sundays. But we really wanted to have a family. And so we adopted Kaia. And it wasn't long before we could no longer take it was probably the next the next Sunday. We get home and we want to lean into our usual Sunday routine of taking a nap and she would have a baby. And we're like, what has happened to our lives?

And we were both respectful enough of each other that, you know, neither one of us was willing to just go take the nap by ourselves. You know, we're like, I guess we'll all stay up. And we were like, that was a pivotal moment for us. We're like, okay, I think our life has changed forever. And so kids do that and they demand sacrifices and work and they take away some of your comfort.

ease and tranquility and some of the nice things that you get to do. And then on top of that, kids notoriously push your buttons, which let's be honest, that's one of the greatest blessings of having kids. So Rachel and I did a podcast, we talked about marriage and pushing your marriage to the breaking point if need be or...

You're leaning into the fact that marriage is this perfect refining laboratory, right? It's the perfect environment for your spouse to say, hey, person. Weaknesses. Yeah. I love you so much and you suck at this. Will you please change that? And you're like, Oh, that really hurts. You're supposed to love me as I am. And like, no, I can't love you as you are because this thing you do is really annoying.

Rachel Denning (08:00.878)
And so marriage is a perfect laboratory. And then you can add kids to the equation. And one is enough, but if you add multiples, now you're like, whoa. You're like a lab rat. And now you have all these little, what do we call them, refining elements causing friction, trying to smooth you out. You're trying to become this polished stone. And so all your rough edges.

will bump up against your spouse and your children, which is what you want ultimately. If you allow that to happen, because the other scenario that occurs, which I think occurs too often, more often than not, is that we get irritated and frustrated by all of these people pointing out our weaknesses, and we then become hardened and resentful and defensive.

And it actually adds more friction to our relationships because we want to defend ourselves against this and say, well, no, it's not, that's not true. I'm not that way. And we want to defend ourselves or ego gets in the way. And then we don't allow it to improve us. We don't allow it to change us. We don't see it as this laboratory of growth. We actually see it as.

something we want to avoid. And this is oftentimes why people will leave their, you know, in extreme cases, people will leave their children, they'll leave their marriage because they're like, I'm tired of this. I'm going to go find someone who will accept me as I am, not realizing that that's not what this whole process is designed for. This process is meant to smooth your edges. And that's a painful experience. And so in this element, if we could break it down to its simplest form,

Having a spouse and children gives you an opportunity, gives you a choice. You can get better or you can get bitter. That's good. And that's really where you're at. And so you have to, well, you have to make a choice and not choosing is a choice. And most of us are reactive. I would say that most are not.

Rachel Denning (10:19.565)
proactive enough about it. We're not conscious or thoughtful enough about it. And so we're reactive. Really, that's what we're going to dive into today. Which is natural and normal. It's not like you're bad or something's wrong with you, if that's the case. That is actually the natural state, in a way, is to be reactive. Right. Because as I see your face here. The natural state of a garden is weeds.

And so you're like, well, that's normal. It doesn't make you bad. But it's a weedy garden. Come on. But go with me here. That's the point, though. The point is, like you were just saying, you have to be intentional because the natural state is the weeds. Yes. So yeah, that's the point. It's not that the garden's bad for having weeds. It's just natural. So if you want it to be something different than weedy, you have to be intentional and take action. You have to cultivate this garden in order to make it beautiful.

That's why I love what Jordan Peterson talks about when like civilization is the perfect mix between nature and like the cultivating part of it. The human involvement of building something beautiful. It's the walled garden, he calls it. It's nature, but it's enclosed and it's safe and it's got the walkways and the pathways and the, you know, it's designed.

So that's kind of what we're talking about here, like marriage and parenting are naturally gonna be a weedy garden. It's gonna be ugly, there's gonna be yelling, there's gonna be resentment, there's gonna be all these things because that's natural. That it's going to be there is that if you don't proactively do something, it will be there. That's what I mean. Okay. I guess that's what I mean. I don't, because...

I want to hold up an ideal. But the ideal is the walled garden. Yes, yes, you're right. And so, but we have to build the wall and we have to weed the garden. Yes. And there's, there's effort in there. And if we don't, that's why we're doing this podcast. That's why we, we do our extraordinary family life coaching. That's why we do the, I have the masterclass and tribe, by the way, you guys had just, I just wrapped up this amazing be the man adventure.

Rachel Denning (12:39.629)
and these slot canyons with 12 great men and incredible, open, authentic, vulnerable discussions about the things we're facing and our challenges and struggles and how can we be better. And it was so awesome. That's why you kind of have this deeper, raspier voice. Yeah, my voice went out and I'm feeling it sound like Batman right now because I spent a week with men.

in the canyons. It was incredible, really incredible. So we'll be doing another one soon because those things fill up fast and they're awesome. But the reason we do all of this is we want to bring awareness to all of you awesome people and hold up this idea and be like, hey, this is possible. Family life doesn't have to be this yelling fest. And it doesn't have to be the constant fight. The challenges that most...

families are yellers and it's pretty chaotic and because I think ultimately because we don't have the tools or the strategies or techniques we haven't really been taught how to do we haven't given it the thought and effort for this refining process we just kind of roll along with it and just keep yelling and our kids have gone to stay with other families and they come back they're like

It was surprising to me how much they yell. And I, we get, you guys, we get to talk to good families every day. And again, like Rachel's saying, and I agree, it doesn't make you a bad person. There's yelling going on, but it's less effective. In fact, let me, here's the bang I wanted to start with. I'm gonna just say it right now. Sorry, we're all the way in, I'm gonna bang right now. Yelling, ultimately, is a symptom or a sign of ineffective parenting. There it is, there's my bang.

We yell because we haven't yet figured out other more effective tools and strategies and techniques and styles and a presence and even an energy or a spirit. There's all these other things to it that make it so much easier and better and more effective parenting. And if we can't figure that out, then we yell. And we like to yell because it works. It gets...

Rachel Denning (15:03.725)
We ask our kids and they ignore us and so we yell and, whoa, they jump. And you're like, oh, that worked. Subconsciously, you're like, well, if I yell, they do it. And so then we get in this habit. It literally becomes a pattern of yelling. So you wake up in the morning and your kids need to be prepared for something or ready for something or do something. And so you wake up and you start yelling and they start jumping and things happen. And so you're like, well, okay.

We'll get into that pattern and you keep doing it. But it's so ineffective. Well, except we were just saying that it is effective. Like it's effective in that it's getting done what you want to get done, but it's ineffective in that the cost for yelling generally comes at the expense of the parent -child relationship. So there is always a cost. And it also affects the child's well -being.

and identity and relationship with themselves. It's interesting how often I get to work with and speak with adults who still have this. Trauma? Yeah, trauma. And I wouldn't say, well, maybe I would. Maybe small levels of trauma, but if a parent is particularly mean or yelling a lot, there's a lot of trauma in that. And I hear.

I hear stories about this all the time. In fact, two in the last week, one from a father who reached out to me and just in his goodness of heart was like, hey, help me not be as explosive. I'm doing way better than I was, but I still am explosive in anger. And I'm gonna do a whole podcast on the Be the Man podcast all about that. How to stop getting angry. Yeah, stop the temper.

and the explosions, right, and get control of that. Because that's something you personally learned how to do because you had a horrible redheaded temper. I had a raging temper. Yeah, it was raging temper. And luckily I was able to just dispel that and get rid of it before I even met Rachel. And you know why? You know the motivating factor was that, for that? I knew, how did I know this?

Rachel Denning (17:24.877)
I didn't even know where South America was. But somehow I knew if I take this temper into my marriage and my family, here's why I knew, because I'd seen it and experienced it as a kid. I had been on the receiving end of it, of raging tempers. And then I'd seen domestic violence and I'd seen other families. That's how I knew. And I was like, I am not.

doing this to my children. And so I had to resolve that. There it is. It was those refining things. It was taking off the rough edges. I had to get rid of that because I knew firsthand the emotional toll, the cost it has. And so, yes, it's effective in that yelling gets your kids to jump and do things, but the exchange rate on that.

is so severe, so intense. The other one that came this week was about a little boy who is already, as a little boy, is experiencing deep trauma from the yelling of his parents. And we see that too. We see that with kids all the time. And it is such a tragedy.

It is and the hard part is that we know it's also...

really tough for the parents. I remember once we were going to church and I saw this, um, this dad trying to get his son, a little boy, he was probably five, trying to get him out of the car and he was like basically yanking on him and I could see the dad was just very upset and the child of course was just sobbing and it was kind of interesting because in that moment I had two separate feelings. I had of course extreme empathy for the

Rachel Denning (19:33.837)
the child because I thought no child deserves to be treated that way. Like there's just no reason that father should be treating his little boy like that. But then the other side was I had a lot of empathy for the dad because I could just knew, like I could tell he was at his wits end. He just didn't know what to do. He was probably exhausted. He was probably overwhelmed. He was probably stressed. Like all of these things that really happened, they're real issues.

Parents are dealing with all of these things. And so it's not like we don't have empathy for that. We understand that as parents, we're dealing with a lot and it's hard. And we don't know what to do because to be honest, our parents didn't do that great job either. You know what I mean? They were doing their best. They struggled. They made mistakes. Like there's just not a history of great parenting.

skills being passed down generation to generation. You know, that's just not a part of the human story. It's not a thing. Right. It's not. The most common thing is bad parenting. Yeah, bad parenting. Most people having some kind of issue from bad parenting. So those of you listening, like let it stop the bad parenting cycle. Let it stop with you and let the new high level, awesome parenting, this legacy of world class parenting begin with you.

So your kids see something different and they pass it on and now generations of parenting greatness happens in your family life. Now I know right away people listening are going to be like, I want that, but how? Because I don't think any parent wants to be someone who's passing on crap to their kids. That's nobody's intention. I'm just going to lean on Nike here for a minute and say just do it.

You and your just do it. While you were telling that story of that gentleman at the church, a couple of thoughts came up that were pivotal for me. Number one was this realization that people are people no matter how small. Your children are people. And not only are they people, like they're divine beings. And in one sense, you stop and say, how

Rachel Denning (21:57.805)
How dare you. How

Rachel Denning (22:06.317)
you ever treat a precious being like.

How dare you.

They're so holy and so pure and so light and so divine. How dare you!

Rachel Denning (22:26.957)
How dare you even speak with disrespect to them because they're little?

Rachel Denning (22:33.933)
let alone the horrible atrocities that are committed against children all the time.

Rachel Denning (22:41.581)
Ugh. They deserve...

so much respect from you and because they don't know better, they're so little. They're just figuring it out. How on earth can you expect them to understand adult things and complex social conditioning and expectations? It's just insane. And you might think, especially with your oldest kid, because you look at your oldest and you look at your youngest, you know.

Jeez, they're so old, they know so much, they're so smart. You should just know better. Like, are you kidding me? Because I could sit down with every single one of you who knows you should be doing things that you're not doing, and I could look you in the face and say, you know better, and you're not doing it. Like yelling at your kids. You know better, and yet you still do it. And so how can you look at your little kids and say, come on, you know better, and get upset?

You have to have so much grace with them. And in a very real, I'm gonna be frank here, lovingly frank, in a very real way.

If they're not doing things that they should be doing, it's on you. You gotta own that crap.

Rachel Denning (24:06.477)
Okay, so that's the first one. First thought was like, see your children, these divine beings, and in this developmental state where their brains, their brains are just developing and especially the little ones, like the way their brain is, you guys and the brain waves and the things that are going on, the brain states, they're transferring in between reality all the time. They...

They're not even clear. They can't know what's real and what's, like they're in this imaginative state and they bounce back and forth. Like they're playing with their Legos or their dolls or their little horses. Like they're there. And you're like, get ready now. And they're like, what? I was just like in, I was just writing a Pegasus, man. What are you talking about? And we get all upset about it. Cause I were a little,

The second thing you said was you had empathy for him as do I, because we're dealing with all of our stuff and all of our responsibilities. It's interesting. You might see yourself as such a patient person until you have children. Or you got your stuff put together thinking, you're like, this is great. And then you're like, oh, jobs. Oh, and then we lost our job. And then house. And oh, the things on the house just broke and the car just broke. And wow, crap.

The stock market just tanked today actually, which is awesome. Oh, it's only awesome if you're invested the opposite direction, which is another, that's a podcast for another day. Tangent. Tangent. And you just have so much stuff going on. So you have all your stresses and worries and concerns and now you have all this stuff and you're exhausted and kids notoriously keep you from sleeping well and on and on and on. So you have all this stuff.

And you might be thinking, look, I would be a way better parent if I wasn't so tired and if I didn't have so much going on, if I wasn't worried and stressed about all this stuff. Which is true. It's so true. It's absolutely true. But it's not. You said he looked like he had reached his wits end. Yeah. Which that was the second thought. One of the things we have to do, ladies and gentlemen, is extend and expand our own.

Rachel Denning (26:32.941)
Capacity Expander with end. Yes, we have to be able to handle more We have to no exceptions. No excuses You have to increase your capacity. You have to be able to handle more if you are constantly bothered by small things then in total honesty, you are a small person and That's just on a straight talk

You are responsible for your own capacity. Increase your limits. And if you are so easily at your wit's end, if you're so easily reaching your limits, you have pathetic little limits. And that has to stop. And just expand it. Push it. Choose to do challenging things that expand your capacity where you realize what's actually hard. Right.

My kids will be like, this is so hard. I'm like, you know what? No, walking across Siberia in winter, that's hard. Stop. Let's go. These are actual statements by Greg Denning to his children. Well, and no, I think this brings up a good point because back to this idea of people asking, well, I want to, but how do I do this? This is one of those ways you have to create. You have to expand your own personal limits.

Because when you do that...

you get angry less often because you're pushing yourself, right? And so you're not bothered by small things, including your children, as often because you have expanded your ability to deal with hard things. Now this plays out in a lot of different ways and we think that it's not connected, but it is actually very much connected. For example, one thing you do is you take cold showers. And...

Rachel Denning (28:35.021)
You think, well, how does, you know, how could taking cold showers affect your parenting? Well, it's all directly connected because you, you, I'm talking about you as a person, Greg Denning, are constantly pushing your boundaries and your limits and pushing what you can do. You're able to be pushed by a lot of irritating things, potentially irritating things and not get irritated by them because you have pushed your limits. So by choosing.

to push other limits, I'm increasing my own capacity. I've been doing this deliberately for decades. And I did it today. You guys, I am so exhausted from this trip. Just physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, socially, just spent. And - You wanted to take a nap. I wanted to sleep for 48 hours. Like, I am spent. And -

We got up, got going, and my daughter was, you know, she's making some huge life decisions and she was feeling frustrated. And I love one of her ways to just let off steam is to go do martial arts with me. And so she's like, dad, let's go over and let's go box in the gym. Yeah, she asked, she's like, dad, will you go boxing with me? And we knew that meant. And when she asked, I'm laying on the couch. Ready for a nap. Like, please just let me sleep until tomorrow. Like, can I go to bed now and get in a 15 hour?

that night and she asked and I'm like, okay, she needs an outlet. I'm like, let's go. And so I went over and we had a great martial arts session, really Krav Maga stuff we did and it was fantastic. She felt better, I felt better. And I'm like, we're here, might as well hit the weights. So I hit the weights really hard, push, push, push. And then I was like, you know what, Kaya, go ahead and drive home. She's like, well, I gotta go, cause she had to go to work. I'm like, you know what, you go. I'll finish my workout and then run home.

And then, you know, and I'm like, you guys running, how have you gonna seen me? I was just like, oh, this is killing me. I mean, my legs have not recovered from last week. And the challenge is we put ourselves through some grinds. We were doing 12, 13 hour days. Yeah, long, long times. And then I got an opportunity to carry some extra packs, as is my norm. And, you know, just push those limits, which is fantastic.

Rachel Denning (30:57.133)
And so then I'm running home and just spent and I'm almost at the house just like ready to be done. And I noticed a gentleman who he was struggling. This tractor, this huge tractor had a huge flat tire. And so I'm like, well, got help. He ran my tire, got to stop and help. And so he needed some help. So I ran to my brother's house, filled an air compressor, put the air compressor on my shoulder, ran back.

What? Help this guy, yeah. Pumped up his tire, helped this guy get his tractor off, and it was awesome. And so you're pushing limits, right? Do you know what's interesting, though? I just want to interrupt for a minute, because you literally came home with more energy than when you left. Yep. Because I'm an energy generator, babe. But that's kind of the irony, though. We think that it would be more drain. And yet.

you were laying on the couch exhausted and after doing all of that you came back with more energy. Because I know how to turn up the energy. Right. And there's something else that's really fascinating because I think and I've noticed this anytime you've had to we've had to do anything that's really big or really challenging or really pushing our limits that it almost like it puts you in the state of mind where other things don't seem that big of a deal.

Suddenly your child being upset is you're like, okay, this is no big deal. Let's solve the problem. Let's deal with it. Because you literally have expanded your borders. You've expanded your boundaries and you feel bigger, more capable, more, more, you have a wider perspective, I guess.

So I guess that's an invitation. Purposely choose to do things that challenge you and you will increase your capacity. So choose to do physical challenges or easy examples, right? Sign up for a race or a triathlon or a marathon or an Ironman or go climb a big mountain, take cold showers, like do something physical because what it's doing when you're pushing these limits.

Rachel Denning (33:16.781)
is you bump up against those limits. And nature does this really well. You get way out there and you're like, well, if I want to survive another day, I have to make it back to the car, even though I don't feel like it. I'd rather sit down and just be done. Like, you don't have a choice. You got to get back. And so it pushed the limit. And then you get back here like, holy crap, I did that. Right. Well, and then it gives you that mentality of like, even when I reach my limits, I'm still able to keep going. I'm still able to make it to the car because...

I had to. And that's one of the things, like if we want to talk about our parenting strategy, I think that is one of the things that's helped us in that we've done things that have helped us realize that when you reach your limits, there's still more to give. You still have reserves. And so this might sound very counterintuitive a lot of ways, because I know there's plenty of moms out there, and dads too, saying I'm

doing lots of hard stuff. I'm overwhelmed. I've pushed my boundaries. Like, what do you mean do more, do harder things? Like, I already feel like I'm doing too much or I'm doing more than I can handle. And the irony is, no, you're not. And by pushing yourself further and harder, you actually will be able to handle what you're currently doing with much more ease. Yeah. Because you've increased your capacity.

Exactly. And so when you increase your capacity, you can handle more easier. Right. And so what used to overwhelm you, you're like, I got this. Exactly. And so, but this has to be done strategically because you don't want to wear yourself out or burn yourself out. So when you increase the, when you take on these challenges or push harder, you have to actually, you have to really include recovery and rest and make sure you're getting.

back to a really good place. Yes. And so it's not just stress, stress, stress. It's stress and recovery. So you're growing in capacity and you're feeling good. And again, all of this necessitates a lot of deliberate self care. I guess that would be another invitation. I'm going to say you have to get really, really good at self care, at taking care of you and

Rachel Denning (35:40.749)
your things and like making sure you're in a good state and you have to do this in micro dosing and macro dosing, meaning you have to do it on a daily basis. Ideally like in mornings or something where, or throughout the day where you feel like you feel a recharging and filling your well. So you have more to give. I think I just want to emphasize this self care thing. Cause I, I know for a lot of

moms, they just feel like it's so unrealistic. Because what you were talking about there is true. Because we're talking about, oh, you have to push your boundaries more. But if you did just that, you would actually burn out. So that alone is not enough. You have to do this process of what we call stress and recover. Stress and recovery. Pushing your boundaries more is stress. Doing hard things is stress. That's stress on your body, your mind, your emotions, all of these things. You have to have...

equal recovery. And that is one of the things we're always really good about. Like we're great at recovering. You know, we can push, push, push, push, but we also will recover so that we don't just burn out. And we've noticed there's been times in our life, in fact, right now is kind of one of them, when we know what it's like to be more normal because we feel like we're just going, going, going with...

less recovery time and I'm like, man, this is how most people live. I don't know how they do it because it's so exhausting and it's so unsustainable. It's not sustainable to just keep going, going, going, going all the time without proper recovery because recovery is key to maintaining your sanity and expanding your ability to do more. So you have to get really good.

at doing recovery, which is what some people call self -care. And that can be a lot of different things for different people. Right. Just hearing you say that makes me realize my suspicion that some of you listening, you're probably yelling more than you would otherwise simply because you're not getting enough recovery. Exactly. Or getting no recovery. Right. Because some moms are not. They're getting no recovery at all. And so they're...

Rachel Denning (38:04.205)
Yeah, they're at their wits end and yelling is one of the reasons, that's one of the reasons we yell when we're at our wits end, because they're not getting recovery. So it's kind of, you know, two parts here. You need to be able to push your ability to do more. And I think a great example of this is anyone who has more than one child realizes what that's like. You feel like, I remember when we had our first child, I felt like, oh my gosh, I'm so busy, I'm so overwhelmed, I have so much to do.

And now I have seven children and I'm like, that was a piece of cake. Like it was so easy to have one child, right? Because I've expanded my ability to do things. So that's kind of what we're talking about with expanding our capability and capacity. But along with that, I've also increased my ability to recover. Which you have to do. You absolutely have to do. So let's, those of you who are listening, if you're making a list.

Add that to the list of necessary steps or ingredients. You have to have effective recovery and you can know if it counts when you feel better. You feel ready to reengage. Some of you, like you take a break or you take a trip or something thinking, I'll come back recovered and ready to reengage and you go on your trip.

And you come back. Go, go, go. Yeah. And you go, go, and you come back and you just, I don't know, I think, I think by default, we just kind of naturally assume it will come back better. But that's like assuming you'll just get better with age. You won't. Some people just get older. Right. And there's also a big difference between recovery and escaping. Some people feel this overwhelm. They feel all of the stress. And so what they do is they try to escape.

with something we call buffering, maybe they'll get on their phone, they'll scroll on Instagram, they'll watch a show. Like they're doing these things trying to escape, but that's not true recovery. True recovery will make you feel better after, and you'll be ready to re -engage. Sometimes that's a nap or sleeping. It's definitely going to bed at a decent time and getting up at a good time, like having those regular routines. Sometimes it's reading, sometimes...

Rachel Denning (40:27.405)
Interestingly, it's working out. I know for me and for a lot of people, the stresses of the day, they stop the stresses of the day by engaging in a hard workout. You think, well, that doesn't seem like rest or recovery, but physical activity, I just did it today, as the story told. That was a form of recovery from other things. Right. Interestingly for me, one of my things is just bringing order to my house.

So especially if I'm, well, I like to alternate activities actually. That's one way I recover. Is if I'm doing a lot of mental work or computer work, I like to alternate it with physical movement work of like ordering my house. And then vice versa, if I'm doing a lot of that, I like to alternate it with writing or being on the computer creating something or reading. So it's kind of like I'm alternating different types of activities. That can, I think.

brain recovery. I know it does for me. Like switching gears. I love that. That's beautiful. And so you find effective good things and you even do it in time periods or batching and blocking time, right? I'm going to do this and then I'm going to switch to this and just changing throughout the day is helpful that way. And so, you know, people might be saying, well, what does all of this have to do with yelling at your kids? Right? And

The reason why we're talking is everything. The answer is everything is connected. Your well -being, your stress levels, your recovery or lack of recovery are all contributing to your yelling. All of it. And so too is your health. Yes. So too is your psychology, your mindset. Your marriage. Yes, your marriage for sure.

your relationship with yourself, your relationship with food, your relationship with money, your relationships with other people, your whole paradigm for life, like your own state of being is affecting all of it. Exactly. Because what is happening here, and this brings up another good strategy I want to talk about, is for most people, they're taking all of those things and they're carrying it with them wherever they go. So...

Rachel Denning (42:46.669)
They're stressing about the money and they're stressing about the marriage and they're stressing about this and then they carry it with them and it comes out basically vomited on the kids because now the kids have done one last thing the final straw and now You're vomiting all of this stacked emotion on them in the form of yelling What you have to learn to do which one this is something we do every single day is process your emotion and like

deal with it I guess like you have to like understand what's causing you to be irritated or annoyed or frustrated and then

either do something about it or realize you can't do anything about it and release it, right? So I know for me, anytime I'm feeling irritated or annoyed, I identify it right away. What is causing this? Because if you don't, if you don't identify it, you just, you kind of have this irritation and annoyance and then something else happens that irritates you more and then something else, and like the irritation just builds and it builds and then.

then whoever the next person is that steps into your space, that is a little pushes a button or hits a nerve gets the full load. Right. It's a law of proximity. I walk in, hey babe, could you help me with this? Oh, that was it. What is it? Do you know how much I have to do? You don't even know. And on it goes. But if you can go through this process of processing emotion as you

are feeling it, right? When you start to feel that annoyance, say, wait, I'm feeling annoyed. And this is, I have this conversation in my head, like I'm speaking it out here. I'm feeling annoyed right now. Why am I feeling annoyed? Oh, I'm feeling annoyed because this thing happened with Airbnb or whatever. And then you think through it and you talk through it. Well, what can I do about it? And if there's something I can do about it, like I'll take that action right there. I'm not gonna go interact with my kids without having...

Rachel Denning (44:54.285)
maybe take an action that I could. Because I'm going to take some of that energy and put it on them instead of putting it where it's going to be more useful. If there's nothing I can do about it, then I just say, you know what, I've done what I can, there's nothing I can do about it. Let me transition to being a mom and being in the moment with my kids. Yes, because none of us wants to take the irritation, the resentment, the...

frustration, resentment, even this comes into like self -loathing. You might be angry at yourself or not like yourself or you might still be just pissed about something in the past. And if you take that energy and that state into a parenting situation, even a good one, you pass it on. And you're not...

At your best. Yeah, it comes out in whatever you're doing. So you do have to kind of, we call them transitions. You have to have these transition points where you're like, okay, right now I'm in business mode, but I'm going to go into mom mode and I need to transition into that person I want to be and I need to be. Where I think too often we're not intentional about that enough and we just...

I know moms especially, and I did this. We just go from thing to thing to thing and we're switching back and forth between different jobs and different roles and different tabs. And all of that just gets mixed together in this giant cloud of emotion instead of like separating it out and saying, okay, this is this hat. I'm wearing this hat, right? Home manager. And this is this hat, it's mom.

And I get that there's going to be some natural mixing that goes on. But something that I found very effective that I do is I'll tell my kids, hey, right now I'm in house cleaning mode. That's what I'm doing. That's the hat I'm wearing. So whatever you're demanding of me right now, it's going to have to wait until I'm done with house cleaning mode. And then I can help you with that. With some exceptions. Yeah, obviously there's exceptions. There's always exceptions to that. And age of kids and stuff.

Rachel Denning (47:20.589)
Yes, but you're getting too complicated here now. I know, but I want to make sure because people are like, well, that's a good strategy. I'm going to tell my toddlers that I'm in cleaning mode not to interrupt me. And your toddler is like, I don't even know what mode means. So get me what I want. You're right. But you can learn to explain it to them in a way and have them practice saying, you know, when I'm, yeah, I'll get you this thing. Or you create something. Now that you're talking about the toddlers, you just create a system where like, OK, if you need the snack.

here's the available snacks for you and they're at your height and they're at your level so you don't have to come interrupt me every time you need a snack. Exactly. Systems. You can go get your own snack. These are freely available to you to choose from at any time. And dear listeners, they better be healthy. Well, that's the point. Or I will come haunt your house. Right. That's why I'm saying, you know, freely available. Like I'm going to pick snacks that I'm okay with them eating at any time and here they are. They're available to you. So you don't have to come interrupt me every...

10 minutes for a snack because you've got access to all the food you need. So yeah, I mean, obviously everything is very complex. There's a lot of variation in how things would play out according to age, maturity, all of that. But in a way, what I'm trying to say is that if you learn to recognize yourself, what mode you're in, because there is a different energy to different modes. And if you're trying to be in like business mode, get things done mode,

and then interact with your kids. You're going to be so impatient. You're going to be more impatient. Because you're like, this is a, it's almost like a masculine energy of like, I'm getting things done here now. You know, I'm not, I can't nurture you because I'm getting things done. So when you learn to recognize those modes and recognize that that's affecting how you're feeling, you can kind of, you can explain that to your kids in a way is what I'm saying. Like I'm feeling very get things done right now. So I need to finish doing this.

then I can help you. And then you can switch into a new mode of like, okay, now I'm ready to interact and have patience and be present in whatever you're doing here. So it's just this idea of being able to transition effectively from different roles. And since I'm talking about it, I might as well add this. Like I have found it personally helpful for me.

Rachel Denning (49:49.005)
to chunk my day into different roles, if that makes sense. Again, these are all strategies that help to reduce friction, to help you recover, to help you recognize building emotions. And so I'd like to chunk my day into different time periods. And I'll tell my kids that. Now, obviously my youngest is five now, so they're all a little bit older. And this works.

This works with interruptions when they're younger and you have to expect those interruptions. But if I'm like in the morning, okay, this is homeschool family time. In the afternoon is work time. Like my kids learn to get what the day is like, what the flow of the day is like. And so I can say, hey, I was helping you in the morning. Now it's my work time and I'm in a different mode. So those are a couple of things. But again, it's just being strategic. It's all about being.

more strategic because the more strategic you can be, the less you're going to have these buildups that lead to explosions, which is generally what causes yelling. Generally parents are yelling because they feel the need to explode in a way or on the other side, which I don't know if that's what you're about to say.

They just lack any other strategy. It's our skills. Yep, skills and strategies. And so I guess that's a good transition there is you start looking at like, when is it that you would yell at your kids the most often? Is it in the morning getting them ready for the day? Is it in the evening because they don't go to bed? Is it around getting them to do chores? I hear from parents all the time. They'll say things like,

you know, in the evening I wanted to come home sometime with my kids, but they didn't want to help out and they're fighting and then they won't go to bed. And so I started screaming, yelling, and then, man, I feel horrible because I'm definitely not being the parent I wanted to be or want to be. And I'm not being this ideal person. And now I'm just really frustrated at myself. I'm frustrated at my kids and this is in the family life I thought it would be and ah, and then more frustration, more buildup. And then you create this pattern, almost this addiction. Like, here we go.

Rachel Denning (52:06.413)
It's evening time again and they're going to do what they do and you get caught in the drama triangle. And so then you keep this pattern, this cycle. There we go again. They do that. I do this. Then I, because I do this, they do that. And then I do it. Oh, and there's the reactive. Oh, now my wife, my spouse gets in on it. And then we're here we go. And that goes on. And if you don't stop it and go on for months or years or decades, and it can be, it can just be terrible. So in a very real way, you've probably reached the limit of your current skill sets in that thing.

and where we're specifically talking about parenting, now we can break that down. It might be skill sets on influencing your kids, persuading your kids, explaining things to your kids. Maybe you suck at explaining things and you think your kids understand, but they don't. They don't even know what you're talking about. And you're like, I've said that 10 ,000 times. Like, well, you did it 10 ,000 times, it didn't work. Cause they do not get it. Or maybe you're not good at.

accountability follow through you tell them and you say here's here's what we're going to do and we're going to do it this time but you don't follow through you don't have the accountability and they just get used to that you've trained them to do those things and so when you're like why don't you do it and and then so then you yell right and you went from asking to do it and then then yelling instead of this follow through or you set up I know some of you have massive beautiful charts.

family systems and strategies, but they don't last. They don't work. And honestly, that's on you. There's a lot of honesty today. But it's cultivating these skills and strategies and following through. Again, ultimately, and I wholeheartedly believe this, and I'm not throwing anybody under the bus, but realistically, yelling at your kids is just a symptom of a lack of parenting skills and strategy.

Well, I want to go back to one of the things you talked about because one of the first skills you were mentioning was this ability to persuade or influence your kids. And I think, at least I've seen, that a lot of parents, maybe they don't even see that that's something they need to do, or they don't understand why that's important, because sometimes parents just think, well, I told you to do it. I'm the boss here. And that's enough. Yeah.

Rachel Denning (54:25.869)
Like if I told you to go get ready for bed, you need to just go get ready for bed and just do it. There's no other discussion. There's no other argument. Like that's it. It's done. And I know in our parenting strategy in general, which involves very little to no yelling, we do a lot of explaining and a lot of persuading and a lot of discussing. Like our kids know.

And some people find this irritating, you know, especially with our younger kids. They know they're allowed to ask questions. They're allowed to say no. Right. And I know sometimes that, especially people in the older generation, that drives them crazy. How can your kids just say no to you like that? Well, because they're allowed to have their opinion. And if I can't, because they're human beings. Exactly. And you as a human being would be allowed to say no to me too. And so people find that in...

I can find that infuriating coming from their kids, but it's more this environment of mutual respect. And if I honestly can't convince my child why they need to do something by using my words and my skills of articulation, then I suck at articulating. Because there's a dang good reason for my kids to do everything I ask them. All I have to do is explain it to them and then guess what? They do it.

because they understand and they say, oh, yeah, I get it. That's a good idea. I'll go brush my teeth. Because now they understand and they want to do it of their own accord. That's how we get around a lot of conflict and avoiding yelling is because we're simply telling them and explaining to them. And yeah, sometimes it's multiple times. It's not like I have to tell them one time why they should brush their teeth and they remember it for the rest of their life. I have to repeat it.

But I don't have to yell at them to brush their teeth because I explained to them why they need to brush their teeth. They understand it and they go do it. And so then it either becomes a simple reminder or another explanation and a reminder. But if your kids understand why you're asking them to do it and you ask them gently and you use teaching and persuasion that eliminates this battle, this power struggle. Right. And it's not like you do it because I say so.

Rachel Denning (56:46.893)
And then you... It's like, hey, it's on you. Like, do you want those outcomes? Is that the kind of person you want to be? Is that the kind of life you want to live? And you're teaching as well. Now, I know, of course, people are going to say, well, do I do this with my two year old? And, you know, because they're like, your two year old is not just going to do everything they're supposed to. And you can't explain everything to them. So I so it's not like we're saying that you say to your two year old, is that the kind of outcome you want to have? You know, by not brushing your teeth. There's different strategies you would use in that case where you can make it.

fun and enjoyable and it doesn't have to be a battle, right? But... And still giving them a choice. We'll give a simple example here for little ones. You go in and you and I did this. So brushing your teeth, you go in like, okay, you ready buddy? You want to brush your teeth or you want me to brush your teeth? Yes, exactly. That works great with teeny. Yeah, with the little ones. And so they still get to choose, but it's you give them the options. Yes. And like we want your teeth to be clean, so you do it or I do it.

Right? And then, then you walk through it. So you're still at every step of the way, you're using skill and strategy. And if you get to a point where you're like, man, I, I lack skills here. Right. And so I'm, I keep turning to yelling at bedtime, for example, or getting into going in the morning, what, wherever your spot is, you're like, Oh man, what if I were five or 10 times better at a certain skill?

Could I then stop yelling? Would yelling become unnecessary? And the answer is always yes. And so you have to think through that and acknowledge it and then just work on it and play through it. Did you have something more to add? Well, yeah, I was just going to add to that a bit. Simply just, we know that this works. For one thing, I've yelled. Like when my kids were younger, I did plenty of yelling.

So I know that it works because I gained the skill of being able to. You're making faces over there so you can explain yourself in just a second. You didn't yell that much. Yeah, but I did do enough. How about this? I did enough yelling where I felt bad about it. Yeah. And this was early on. This is what we're talking about. When our kids were... We had four children under the age of four. And there was plenty of chaos and craziness and things like that.

Rachel Denning (59:11.053)
There was a couple times when our children broke our MacBooks and I got very upset and yelled when they were small about it. So I'm saying, what I'm trying to do is say, I understand, I feel that guilt for losing it, for screaming, for getting upset. But what I'm also trying to say is that I know that this works because I gained the ability to be able to communicate with my children in a way through persuasion and influence.

that I reduced my need to yell.

This question just came to my mind. It's like, just ask yourself, in this situation, what do I need to do in order to not yell? What skills do I need? That's the golden question. Yeah. Because if you feel like you're butting up with a kid and all you've got left is yelling, there's a missing piece there. There's a bridge that's not spanning that gap. And that might be...

It might be something, we didn't even touch on this, which this could be a whole nother podcast. It might just be that your relationship with that child is not healthy enough. That account is overdrawn. Yeah, the account is overdrawn. And so the only way you can get that kid to do what you ask is by yelling at them. Now, I don't have to yell at my kids because I have a close attached relationship with each of them that I regularly invest in.

and so when i asked them to do something they willingly do it because they know i'd give as much to them as the why give more than they're being asked to do and if i ever whenever i'm asking them to do something and they seem more reluctant to do it and i feel more of this need to get upset about it i realize the problem is i haven't been investing in the relationship because when i invest in the relationship they're willing to do what i asked

Rachel Denning (01:01:10.317)
Because your children will feel this sense of obligation to you. If you have a good, healthy relationship with them that you're investing in regularly, they feel closeness to you. People call this attachment parenting in some ways. They feel attached to you. They feel a sense of obligation. They feel like they want to, or at least need to, do what you ask because you do a lot of things for them. Right? And so,

You don't have to yell at them to get them to do what you ask because they feel like I need to do what you ask because you do so much for me because you work for me and you invest in me and you cuddle with me and you do all these things. They feel that sense of attachment. So that's another strategy I use if I'm ever feeling this temptation to yell or get upset. I'm thinking, okay, it's my fault. I need to.

cuddle with this kid because they need more of my love and attention and when I do that, guess what? They're like, okay mom, I'm gonna go take out the garbage or whatever. They just do the thing that... Because they want to. They want to. They want to do it. But if you're consistent, it's so ironic and interesting. The more you're yelling and the more the kid's like, I don't wanna do anything you say. And it's almost subconscious. You're sabotaging that. You're sabotaging the results you want to get.

You want them to do what you ask, so you yell at them to get them to do it, but all you're doing is damaging the future asking. That doesn't make sense. Every time you yell, they will become less and less willing and desirous to do what you want them to do. Right. And so it just spirals downwards. You have to do more yelling and more yelling in order for them to do what you ask. You have created your own.

Right. And made it worse. You're exacerbating the problem. So the more often you yell, the more likely it is you'll have to yell. Yes. Yowzers. So think through each child, think through each situation. And here's another strategy I use and that was helpful for me. Because early on as well, and I've told this story in other podcasts and places, there were a couple of times early on the kids were really little.

Rachel Denning (01:03:36.077)
and I had yelled at him for something. And I think the couple of times where it was most poignant, I yelled at him before bed and they went to bed crying. And I went in the other room and I felt so horrible. Like I cried and I went back in to apologize and they were already asleep. And so I couldn't apologize. And so I sat with it all night hurting. And that pain.

turned into power for me. I'm like, I'm not doing this anymore. And so I'm sitting there up all night, like, why do I yell? What's happening? What's going on? And I start walking through the scenarios, like, well, I get impatient. I get frustrated because they do this. And sometimes I was like, wait a minute.

What age should a four -year -old act like?

It would be crazy of me, I'm the neurotic one, to think that my four year old should act like an eight year old. Or I'm like, wait a minute, a four year old is gonna act like a four year old. And if I get bothered that a four year old acts like a four year old, that's my problem, that's a me problem. Or, and again, I got to these places where I was like, okay, wait a minute.

Your kids being kids will break things. Just settle that out, guys. If you have not settled that. I mean, I know you realize that, but you still get frustrated about it. Just stop. They are going to make messes and they are going to break things. They are going to cost you thousands and thousands and thousands of dollars in their mistakes. They're going to get dirty. I mean, all the things that bother you are going to happen. So you know that already. We know that already. Why get upset about it?

Rachel Denning (01:05:31.213)
And that is one of the reasons parents get upset. I know it's one of the reasons I got upset is you have these expectations as though those things are not going to happen. And it is, it's complete, it's completely neurotic to expect that those things are not going to happen with your children. And so, yeah, when you let go of those expectations and something happens and just say, oh, I expected this. And that's where I was going is like, anticipate it.

Know that it's going to happen. Say your kids are going to break something and it's going to cost you money. And here's what I literally went through this mentally. So they're going to break something and it's going to cost me because when they were little, they were wild, you guys. Our kids were just little wild. We had the two boys, especially. They're like less than a year and a half apart. And they were just little.

They thought everything was a jungle gym. They're jumping off everything, climbing, and we wanted them to be climbers. And I mean, now they're, they do gymnastics and the coolest stuff. Like Parker's a stunt man now because we, we fed this desire to climb on everything and jump off, do cool stuff. Like he's literally getting to a career he loves because of that. But it turned, you know, it cost us a couple of laptops early on. And so I remember that getting upset and then thinking, is it worth?

Scalding yelling just hurting this relationship with this sweet little boy over 2 ,000 bucks. Is it worth it for that? And and in my mind I settled it out and I was like, no It's not worth it for for 10 ,000 bucks now and I pushed it I'm like, it's not worth even a would I ruin the relationship with my son over a hundred thousand dollars? Not even that's worth it. Not no amount of money is worth that.

So I'm like, wait a minute, if he just does something, it costs me a few hundred bucks. Really? Should I really get upset? Should I say something mean?

Rachel Denning (01:07:39.629)
Should I do something that hurts? No. And if I can anticipate it and know it's going to happen, or the other one that gets parents is your kids will do things that embarrass you. They will. They'll do things that embarrass you. If you anticipate it and be like, oh, I knew this was going to happen. And I thought ahead of time how to respond to it as my best self instead of react to it as my lowest self. Then I don't have to. Now the other side of this too, the...

I think is also effective is that if you have that mindset of anticipating the things that could go wrong or get broken or get messy or whatever, you also have the opportunity now to use your power of persuasion and discussion to talk through that with your kids and say, hey, this is what I see could happen. What can we do to prevent that? Like, hey, we could break this laptop because we learned our lesson. We lost two laptops and that was enough. And then we created rules in our family where we've never lost a laptop.

Like the rules still stick. Like people, we don't have any liquids next to the laptops, you know, we don't set them on the edges of things. We created these rules that prevented those things from happening again. So you can have that similar scenario of saying, okay, I'm seeing, I'm anticipating what could happen. Let's talk through it with the kids and say, how can we prevent this from happening? Same thing with even being embarrassed or something. If you're gonna go to someone's house, like,

And we still do this. We talk with our kids. What's going to happen inside? What are we going to do? How are we going to behave? What kind of words are we going to use? We talk through it, preparing them to behave. And that always creates better behavior because it's fresh on their mind. Because it's not like they want to be a terror, per se. They're usually a terror when, one, they don't know what's expected, and two, they're not feeling that their needs are met.

And even when they forget, because we've anticipated it, we don't have to get all bent out of shape and upset or whatever. We can go talk to them. It's easier to remind them when you had the talk beforehand, saying, hey, remember we talked about this? And then it's, you can talk about it instead of yelling and saying, what's wrong with you? I told you to do this. You know, you don't have to get upset because you've had the conversation and you can just remind them here.

Rachel Denning (01:10:00.557)
I want to share yesterday's story. I think it's fitting. So I was leading this trip, right? Driving down, right before I get there, we're going to southern Utah because there's lots of slot canyons there. To lead a men's adventure. Leading this adventure for men. About an hour before I get there, the AC stops working in our new, sweet adventure van. And it was 108 degrees.

And I'm like, I gotta fill this van full of men and drive around all week. Without an AC and it's 108 degrees. Like this is not okay. So I hurried to the mechanic. So I had all this stuff I had to do, right? I had tons of logistics I'm taking care of. Well, that just got, you know. Wrench thrown in the door. And so I go to the mechanic and they're like, yeah, you got a hole in it. You know, it's just a manufacturer fault. The two tubes ran together and punctured a hole. And I'm like, okay, give me a part.

I'm like, nobody has the part. It's like, you have a new vehicle. Like, we won't carry that part for a couple more years. Right? I was like, okay. So like a couple of things happened that was going along and then we had our little Airbnb thing go wrong. So it was, it was to the tune of quite a few thousands of dollars this week. Yeah. And just like, okay, there's, there's some frustrations here. And, but the week went well. It was fantastic trip. I'm driving home.

in the heat, no AC. Okay. Trick went well, on top of all that, but you were also exhausted because you did like five days of... We went hard, right? Really hard. Canyons. And so pushing my body hard and then I get up at 4 .30 because I wanted to surprise Rachel and meet her and the family in the mountains, which I did. So...

I was crazy tired. So you got up early, drove five hours to meet me and surprise me. And then to do a big hike. And then we did a big hike that was three miles round trip, but it was like tons of elevation gain. So I'm just spent, right? And the only thing I want to do is just go home and sleep. I'm just, I'm exhausted. And we have this nice BMW and my son is like.

Rachel Denning (01:12:15.533)
Let me drive the car down. I'm like, sure, man. It's cause it's fun to drive this car. It's a great car. And some rocks had fallen in the canyon. And so we're driving along. I see the rocks way out. I'm like, he'll just swerve around them. They weren't huge rocks, but they were big enough. It was, it was, it was big enough. Anyways, so we have, we have a, a nice BMW. It's low to the ground. We have aftermarket really fancy wheels and tires and you know, rims and, and.

He hits it, he hits the rock and destroys the tire and the rim. In the canyon. And it goes flat. And yeah, it immediately goes flat. It's a super tight, dangerous canyon that's packed with people and cars zooming up and down. There's no space. And I'm like, okay. And in a point of exhaustion, and already having the AC thing and driving without AC all the... Anyways.

So I'm tired. He was taking you back down to the van without you seeing him. Yeah, he's taking me back down and I'm like, okay, this is good. And it happens, I'm like, I just wanted to go home, man. And so I'm realizing this moment, he's gonna feel terrible, right? He made a mistake, he's gonna feel bad. I don't need to yell at him. I don't need to say anything mean. I didn't need to say it. There's no reason. He gets it, he's a sharp kid. So I'm like, okay.

Well, let's just, let's just fix the tire. Well, there's no stinking jack in this car or lug wrench. So we're sitting on the sides of the road blocking these other cars. It's our daughter's car and we've never checked it for this. Yeah, she's driving it and I was like, oh no. So we had none of the parts. I'm falling behind in a different car and I pull over and I'm just trying to see what's going on.

They've got none of the parts to fix it. There's no service in the canyon. Right, so you can't call anybody. And I'm just like, are you kidding me? Like this is one of those scenarios where it would have been very easy to yell and to be very upset. And instead of that, I was exhausted and I was frustrated. I'm like, are you kidding me? It's one thing to just totally destroy a rim and tire.

Rachel Denning (01:14:40.429)
and the cost there and the inconvenience. But it's another thing to be, you know, in a moment of like, oh, I don't even have the tools, because I have a spare tire, but I don't have the tools to fix the spare tire. It's another level of like, are you kidding me? This is ridiculous. And so I just, to not say anything.

to not do anything that I would regret. I just took a few steps away. Walked away, stared at the river. I was just staring at the river and the trees and they're so peaceful and so beautiful. It was lucky we were in nature. It was fortunate, I mean. I sat there, I'm like, this is so pretty and so peaceful. And so I just went through quickly in my mind, I was like, well, what's done is done. I just had to figure out a solution. I'd rather be home sleeping, but I'm not. We gotta figure this out. So let's go.

teach the kids how to figure this out. How to change a tire. And so we ended up borrowing some tools from a family that spoke very little English. Luckily, we speak Spanish. And so we got connected with them. They were super cool. Got the tools, changed the tire, and changed it out. The two older kids got to learn how to do it and kind of figure out how to get out of a bind. And on our way. And I didn't yell at my son.

or say anything mean or tear him down in any way. And then he was so hesitant to drive. And I'm like, uh -uh, buddy, back in the driver's seat. And he's like, you're so cruel, is what he said to me. I was like, this isn't cruel. I was like, I'm proving my total trust in your competence. Like this is because I trust you, buddy. So I had him drive the BMW. And then when we got back to the van, I had him drive the van.

And we just talked and had a great time, a great conversation. And then I sent him a text today letting him know how proud I am of him. And he's just a great, great young man. And so in a moment that we lost money yesterday, it actually was embarrassing in lots of ways. But okay, so what? It was inconvenient. I was exhausted. But you don't have to.

Rachel Denning (01:17:00.941)
and it changes everything. So anticipate frustrations. Think through and write down how you would respond as your best self instead of yelling. Think through, get creative about all the things you can do instead of yelling. Like get creative, do whatever you have to do, but please, please, please, please, I beg of you, stop yelling.

I've heard stories recently and long ago that break my heart.

Rachel Denning (01:17:40.813)
You don't know what wounds you're opening up in your children and in your spouse with your yelling. Some wounds that never heal. Please do whatever you can, whatever you have to do to stop yelling. And it's interesting because I think in general society...

understands the pressure that moms especially are under. They realize that there is a lot of pressure and they know that moms feel bad about it. They feel guilty for the yelling and the getting upset and that's fair. But on the other side of that coin is the fact that you are an adult and you need to be the adult.

and you need to be the one that's more mature in this relationship with your child and you are the one that needs to be in control. You've got to get your crap together because it is damaging your kids. And some of that damage is going to last a lifetime. And I know speaking as a mom, you feel guilty about that enough already. And there's been times where I've yelled and got upset and I've cried worrying that I've damaged my kids forever.

So I get that pain, but let that pain drive you to stop yelling. Let it drive you to develop your skills enough.

that you don't have to use that as a tool. Now, I'm gonna be honest here and say there is a time when I still will use yelling intentionally as a tool, not in anger, because there's a difference. You can yell for emphasis when it's needed. And be as calm as a spring morning inside. And be in control. And I will do that if I need to. If I feel there's a point when my kids need some emphasis here.

Rachel Denning (01:19:47.789)
I will raise my voice to emphasize, but it's not with anger. Right, you turn up the volume to, for a very specific reason and you use it rarely. And when I feel it's needed, not just because I've lost it or I'm completely at my wits end. If I feel I'm getting to my wits end at this point, I just leave. I go in the other room and I gather myself together because I realize how damaging it can be.

So if you, you know, I'm just saying, you can use yelling as one of the tools you use, but it shouldn't be the main tool. You don't need to take that hammer and keep hammering everything in your family. And if possible, you shouldn't yell when you're angry. Yes. Because the tone, the energy, and the things you might say. Yes. They're going to be way more hurtful. So bad. When you yell when you're using it on purpose and intentionally, you're saying the right things. You're saying the things they need to hear, not the things that are

hurtful. Right. So there's a very different feel behind it because when you yell in anger especially if you're out of control raging anger you say and do things that you wouldn't do otherwise and that's especially damaging. This is a good opportunity to do a self -evaluation of how you use your voice and how you use volume. For many parents they've told me the only time they ever raise their voice is in anger.

And I think it would be valuable if we raise our voice for all kinds of things. I think for me personally, I raise my voice every day, but it's an excitement. So my kids are used to that. I mean, from the time they're in the womb, like there's volume, like dad's loud, man. And it's not an anchor. It's generally excitement, enthusiasm. It's like all kinds of stuff. So.

Again, you're conditioning your children and training them. If the only time they ever hear you get loud is because you're yelling at them, wow, what kind of trigger does that set up? What kind of neuro associative conditioning does that make? Even their biology starts to respond to you being loud. And if they know the volume goes up, they're like, oh, what have I done? Instead of, oh, I wonder what mom's excited about. Man, what's dad getting so fired up about? Right?

Rachel Denning (01:22:15.981)
It becomes curious or my kids, they're just gonna just like, if I get loud, they're like, ooh, what's going on? Let's get excited. It's great. Whoa, let's go see what's going on. And again, it's training, it's conditioning. So we are empathetic. We understand how frustrating it'd be. And those of you with kids who are particularly challenging, I know many of you, maybe all of you have at least one kid who's that.

You want to wring their neck? I could yell, every word could be in high volume to that kid. Even be more creative. Circling back to where we started, this is your opportunity to grow, to refine, to expand. This is your chance for you to become extraordinary. I just want to add something, I think, with those kids. I think very often those kids, they need more.

love and attention. They need more cuddling, they need more acceptance. They need to feel the sense of being okay as who they are. And I know that's made a difference with some of our kids that can be the annoying one sometimes, to just let them feel like, you know what, you're okay, I love you. And we don't always know, and you don't always know what's going on in your child's biology or brain makeup or what their experience is. They're

The human body for the first 25 years is going through unbelievable transformations and changes. And it's not always the cleanest process. It doesn't always work like clockwork. It'll work out, but then it's not always, it's not always just straightforward. So be patient, be calm, be loving, be real, like Rachel's saying, really invest, invest even more.

And those kids do whatever you have to do. Like, pull all stops, you guys, and just go all in to parenting. And I know you're sitting and saying, I am all in. What do you think I'm doing? I'm at my end. Like, you have more to give, and you have more to grow, and more to gain, and there's more you can do. But you have to get kind of crazy creative sometimes. If you're just like, oh, we're doing all things right here. Like, OK, whoa, what other big things can you do? What totally different things can you do? What?

Rachel Denning (01:24:43.181)
complete pattern interrupters can you have? How can you just, in a positive way, be a massive disruptor in your family, if needed? I want to also go back to this idea about investing into the relationship, because I truly believe that most behavior issues, you know, any of the things that kids do that are annoying or not listening or all those, most of those are caused by some sort of rift.

in the parent -child relationship. And the way to fix that...

is with bonding and listening and paying attention to their needs. I know we're almost done here, but I think I'm going to tell this story because I think it's very instructive. We're on this trip. We drove across the country. We were in Oklahoma. And we'd had a really long day. We'd gotten up early, super early, to drive 13 hours or something, 12 hours to Oklahoma.

And then when we got there, the kids swam in a pool and then we were in the hot tub. So by now it's nighttime, it's dark, it's nine o 'clock at night or something or later. And our five year old was starting to act up, right? She was starting to be annoying. She would be splashing you in the face and usually we'd be like, hey, don't do that. It's annoying, you know? And she'd stop, but she kept doing it. And she just kept having kind of these, it wasn't anything severe, but for us it was like, okay, she's misbehaving, right?

There was signs and symptoms. Right. But we have learned to pay attention to those things, so we knew it meant, something's off here. She's misbehaving, she's not doing what we asked, something's off. Now, a lot of parents, they just ignore them. Or they start getting more upset. Hey, I told you not to do that. Yeah, they start yelling. And then they're like, I'm going to put you in a timeout. Well, I know none of that works. And so my answer was, hey, what's going on? Why aren't you doing this? I'm...

Rachel Denning (01:26:47.277)
I'm ready for bed. I'm tired. Okay, she's telling me. She's communicating. I've reached my end. I'm done. I want to get out. Now, my inclination was to just stay in. I didn't want to get out. I was sitting in the hot tub. I was having a nice time. I didn't want to get out and go put her to bed.

But as the parent, I'm the adult here. I'm the one that has to be more mature and I'm the one that has to make the sacrifices. Because when I do, family life is easier. So I got out and I took her upstairs and put her to bed and she was asleep in five minutes. Gone, just passed out. Yeah. And here's an interesting thing. Here's a child who has some needs. She's feeling needy. She's feeling exhausted. Yeah.

And as a five -year -old, we can't have high expectations of five. I mean, you can have good expectations, but you're like, OK, if a five -year -old's tired, she's got a limit of what she can handle. So if you can visualize this, here's this child that needs love and attention and caring. And if we respond with yelling in a moment of need,

It's like the worst thing we can do. Yeah, she feels hurt. She feels attacked. She feels all of these conflicting things that she doesn't understand because she's like, I have this need. I'm trying to communicate this need to you. By acting out, she doesn't know. Her little vehicle is like, I'm going to be a little bit annoying here. Because something's going on. I don't know what's happening. I don't feel right. I'm going to be annoying. And what she's expressing is, I need you. I need you. I need you. And then I'm like.

If I were to yell, rawr, like.

Rachel Denning (01:28:34.285)
She's asking, what's the pair of...

The son asks for something and the dad gives him a serpent or something. Yeah, if you ask for a fish, will I give you a stone? Right. Why can't we remember this, Austin? I've talked about this so many times, I can't even remember what it is. But it's like they're asking for something and you lash out and attack. They're like, wait, I was just asking for love and you're attacking me? Right. Because on a psychological level, what's actually happening, especially...

This happens with babies all the time. And of course, as they get older too, even up to five, they are trying to communicate their needs. And if that is responded to with negative emotion, the assumption they create or the rule they create in their mind is that if I need something that's wrong, because people get upset at me for needing something. And then they come to a conclusion of like, wow, when I'm at a low spot and...

I really need help from my parents. I can't get it. They're going to attack me. I can't turn to people for help because they attack me when I seek help. So this is, and I know that this sounds like, wow, that's deep, but this is what's happening on a psychological level. That's why you have to be so careful with responding to your children's needs with love and attention because that's what they need. Now too often, unfortunately, what we see and,

This is why it's so funny to me to go to parks because every park is like this. Parenting exhibit. Yeah, it's parenting on exhibit. And I'm always just like, oh my gosh, these poor parents and these poor children. Because you see these children trying to communicate needs and the parents responding with time out or yelling or getting upset. Or shaming them. Yeah, or shaming them. Or insulting them.

Rachel Denning (01:30:31.757)
Yeah, and so what you have to do is pay attention to what it is your kids are communicating to you and asking from you and if you meet those needs you actually remove most of the behavior issues. It goes away. And if that doesn't work you just spend more time cuddling with them. I find that that works with all of my small children and sometimes my teenagers. Oh, it totally works for them too. When I say...

Let me just finish, then you can say it. When I see them acting up, I will very often say, why don't you go cuddle with me on the couch? And we sit for five or 10 minutes, they feel better, and then we're done. They stop misbehaving. Love that. So those of you listening, what if that were your response? Instead of yelling, you go cuddle. Let's go sit on the couch together. Your kids are gonna look at you and be like, what?

Who are you? What is this? So I had a coaching client. His kids would, they would duke it out and he works from home, right? And he would hear them fighting. And we were walking through this, like one of the things he really wanted to improve and he would hear them fighting and he would get so sick of his kids fighting. He wants a peaceful home. So he'd walk upstairs and yell at the kids to stop fighting. And all of a sudden, like without realizing he's engaged in the fight. And then instead of two, there's three.

I said, we'll fix that. And he's like, what do you mean? It was fun walking through this process. Like, what else could you do? Instead of going up and yelling at them to stop fighting, what else could you do? And he's like, I don't know. Like, yelling works. I go up and yell, they stop fighting. I'm like, just go up and just don't get engaged in the fight. Just go up and start loving on them. Just put your hands around them. Just love on them. Tell them you love them. Talk to them gently. Just totally change the energy.

I'm always saying you have to be responsible for the energy you bring. I said try it. And he was like, it's amazing. Can you just walk up there? And he had to settle his mind and heart before he walked upstairs. They're fighting again. He's getting interrupted for work, which is annoying. They're fighting. He doesn't want fights in the family. He's like, all right, but he had to settle everything. And I'm like, I'm just going to walk up there peacefully. Walk up, put an arm around him, love him, maybe sit down with him, talk to him. Guys, let's not do this. Come here, I love you.

Rachel Denning (01:32:58.829)
This is why I just talk them through it. And it just had such a calming effect. And I mean, you mentioned this earlier, like yelling doesn't work long -term. It doesn't create the long -lasting results you want. And in fact, it actually creates long -lasting damage. So come in with peace, with gentleness, with other strategies. When you feel like yelling, hug.

cuddle, compliment, be the pattern interrupter. And they may not always want to shift, right? Because they're in this moment of like, no, I wanna, and sometimes maybe you're even addicted to yelling. You wanna stay in the fight, you're mad and you wanna be mad. You wanna yell and somebody's like, hey, please don't yell. And you're like, no, I'm gonna finish this, right? You get caught up in it. But be willing to just break away from it.

Step away, breathe, read, meditate. Go punch a punching bag. Yeah, go. Go yell at the trees. Go write mean things on paper and then burn it up and throw it away. Like do whatever you have to do, but shift that whole pattern. And if you have a habit and a pattern of yelling, you're going to have to be really intentional about - To create a new habit. A new pattern, yep, and a new habit. And you're going to have to keep doing, keep doing until it becomes your new way of being. Mm -hmm. And I promise.

Because we have done it together and we've helped others do it, it has the power to totally transform your family culture and family dynamics and your family legacy. And yelling can end with you. Whoa, and it has to. Love you guys. Sweet pepper.

Rachel Denning (01:35:00.973)
you

Rachel Denning (01:35:10.637)
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