May 27, 2025

#314 Getting on the Same Parenting Page —While Honoring the Important Roles of Mom and Dad

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Understanding parenting styles is crucial for raising resilient, confident, and emotionally intelligent children. In this video, we explore the impact of different parenting styles on your child's behavior and development—and reveal the specific things we never do as parents of 7. From avoiding sarcasm to building emotional safety through honest communication, we share actionable strategies to help you create a positive family culture and choose a parenting style that truly supports your child’s growth.

Are you and your spouse constantly disagreeing about HOW to best parent your children?

Are you wondering if one (or both) of your parenting styles is hurting your child’s emotional growth?

And if so, what do you do about it, especially when you disagree so adamantly?

In this episode, we unpack the subtle but powerful effects that parenting styles have on children’s development —especially when it comes to raising resilient, well-adjusted kids .

Many parents unknowingly adopt habits that hold their families back from true emotional health and connection.

Parenting is a daily practice of small choices, and understanding which styles promote emotional intelligence, confidence, and independence can transform your family life.

Join us as we share the key things we NEVER do as parents of 7 children , and how those ‘never-dos’ have shaped a positive, loving family culture where kids learn to thrive .

You’ll hear practical advice on:

How authoritative parenting builds self-worth
Why harsh or inconsistent discipline backfires
The dangers of sarcasm and negative language
Creating open, honest communication at every age
Balancing boundaries with empathy and love

If you want to upgrade your parenting approach and create a nurturing environment where your kids feel safe to grow emotionally, this episode is for you.

Key Takeaways:

✅ Different parenting styles have lasting effects on your child’s emotional and social development

✅ Authoritative parenting fosters resilience and healthy boundaries

✅ Avoid sarcasm, harshness, and inconsistent discipline to build trust

✅ Emotional intelligence starts with authentic, open communication

✅ Small ‘never-dos’ can prevent big problems down the road

Chapters:

00:00 Parenting from the Same Page

06:41 The Importance of Communication in Parenting

13:12 Navigating Parenting Styles

24:08 Understanding Parenting Approaches

31:13 The Four Parenting Philosophies

43:16 The Pitfalls of Authoritarian Parenting

46:00 Understanding Permissive Parenting

51:39 The Consequences of Neglectful Parenting

58:31 The Gold Standard: Authoritative Parenting

01:11:03 Getting on the Same Page as Parents

01:25:51 The Journey of Personal Development in Parenting

Memorable Quotes:

🗣 “Parenting styles shape the adults our kids become.”

🗣 “Harsh discipline creates distance and fear, not respect.”

🗣 “You can’t build emotional intelligence if your home isn’t emotionally safe.”

🗣 “Consistency and love are the true foundation of resilient kids.”

More episodes on working together in parenting and marriage:

RESOURCES:

Let us help you in your extraordinary family life journey.

How We Raised 7 Well-Adjusted Kids - Without Yelling, Tantrums, Punishments or Power Struggles (+ get THE CHECKLIST: Things We Do Every Day to Raise Well-Adjusted Kids)
Rachel’s ⁠⁠ Must-Read Booklist for Well-Read Moms⁠⁠
Greg's ⁠⁠Recommended Reading List for Parents & Youth⁠⁠
Follow us on Instagram: ⁠@worldschoolfamily⁠ or ⁠@greg.denning⁠
Get Rachel's ⁠⁠ Family Systems & Charts ⁠⁠

Join the Do More With Less Stress Workshop Series for busy moms
Become a Founding Member of our Extraordinary Parent Mentoring Method
Join Greg’s 7-Day Challenge
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0:00

Help me figure out how to be the man and not the monster.

You're not getting that?

Then you're doing something wrong.

It's not about who's right, it's about what is right.

You have to improve your ability to communicate with each other.

Please allow your spouse to hold up the mirror.

0:15

Discipline is rooted in teaching, not in punishment.

Nobody, nobody likes to be controlled.

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Extraordinary Family Life podcast where your host Greg and Rachel Denning.

Today we are going to talk about parenting from the same page, or at least the same book.

0:36

We've we've got to do this together.

We have to pull together because if we're not, then in a very real way, we're pulling in the opposite directions.

We're pulling against each other.

And how ineffective is that?

If as a goal we're like, we're trying to raise our kids, but we're pulling in different directions.

0:54

Well, that's going to not work out very well.

Right.

But we also want to talk about how we can parent from the same playbook, but we don't have to be the same people.

We would want to emphasize today the importance and the necessity of having a dad approach and a mom approach.

1:13

Dad doesn't have to become mom, and mom doesn't have to become dad in order for you to be effective parents.

But you do need to have the same underlying parenting style or approach, which we're going to talk through because there's 4 main different parenting approaches.

1:29

And we're going to talk through those and explain what, which one's the best to have as your underlying approach.

But that you can still parent in different ways, like the the way you apply it can be different because 1 is a dad and 1 is a mom.

And that's a good thing.

That's a that's a positive.

1:44

Thing the fundamental goal is that we complement each other in our strategies and tactics, not compete against each other.

And I, I guess we can dive right into the complexity and difficulty of that because I think like a man.

And so I think well, parenting should be done in this manly way.

2:02

And I wouldn't even articulate it be like, well, this is the way it should be done.

And so you're going to approach it like a woman, and I'm going to think, why are you doing it like that?

And and vice versa, right?

You think like a woman, like a mom.

You're nurturing and caring and soft and gentle.

2:19

And you look at me like you're a barbarian.

Don't you dare treat my children like that.

My thoughts.

Right.

And and I got I got to point this out for everybody listening.

The reason we're also different and and men and women is so we can help refine each other.

2:38

So I could say to Rachel, leave me alone, woman, and let me be the man and, and maybe I am doing it wrong and she's seeing that she's like, no, you're being too harsh.

You're being, you're being a barbarian, not a father.

And you're acting from your anger.

2:57

And she can even, you know, she might even notice like, well, hey, I can tell you're upset because, well, I've known you for all these years and you're still upset about something that happened in the past and you're taking it out on the kids.

That's not the point where I'm like, I'm the man here, leave me alone.

That's not that's not when I use this, it's like, oh, thank you, sweetheart, for pointing that out.

3:17

I apologize.

I'm going to go apologize to the kids.

Help me figure out how to be the man and not the monster.

Right.

So while we're talking through this and discussing the underlying parenting strategies and then the differences between how a father and a mother might approach it, we are also wanting to leave space in there for this place of refinement and improvement and growth.

3:41

Yes, you might be approaching it as a mom or as a dad, but you still may be doing it quote UN quote wrong because one it just one sign you're doing it wrong is it just doesn't work Like if you're not getting good results from it.

And I think we all know on some level what good results are.

3:59

It's, it's good and happy feelings, it's good relationships, it's peace in the home.

If you're not getting that, then you're doing something wrong.

And so you need to improve and change and tweak.

Even if you still have a more feminine approach or more masculine approach, there's levels and ways to have that.

4:17

There's obviously the toxic way and it's not just toxic masculinity.

There's toxic femininity too.

And then there's the better, higher way.

And so that's what we're all we're after.

We're after being true to ourselves, approaching our parenting from the feminine or the masculine, but at the best version of the feminine or masculine, not at the worst.

4:39

Yes.

So I guess the fundamental here is it's not about who's right, it's about what is.

Right.

And so if the two of us together saying, hey, we both see this very differently, but we're not competing.

It's not I'm right and you're wrong or you're right and I'm wrong.

4:55

It's like, what's the right way?

What's the best way to get consistently get the results that we want?

And we keep iterating, we keep adjusting, we keep refining until we get the result.

And, and you'll hear Rachel, I talk about this endlessly.

5:12

It it's math, it's an equation.

Each kid is an equation.

And don't take it personal.

It's like until you get the the solution to the equation, keep working the equation just keep going and keep changing keep.

Tweaking.

Tweaking until you get it right.

5:29

And if it's not consistently right, predictably right, then you're doing it wrong.

Yeah, and and it's it's OK.

So with that doesn't make you a bad person.

Right.

Just because you just have figured it out problem, right doesn't mean you're a bad person.

It just means you didn't do the math right.

And that's OK You just keep working at it until you get the math right, Right.

5:48

Yeah.

So.

Should we dive in?

I want to hit something just right from the gates.

And I think most parents struggle getting on the same page or around the same core philosophy because they haven't yet learned how to have uncomfortable, disagreeing conversation.

6:09

I think that's a that's the fundamental piece.

And so while we're talking about parenting, this is individual work.

And let's say, well, I, I, I would comfortably and confidently say that most adults grew up in an environment where they never learned how to do that.

6:26

It was fighting, it was chaos, it was mayhem.

They never learned how to sit and disagree.

And, and that was true for me and true for you.

But early in our marriage, we realized, OK, we got to figure this out.

Like we can't get upset and storm off and, and do the silent treatment.

6:43

We can't slam doors, we can't yell and scream like that resolves nothing.

And so as uncomfortable as it was, you and I, we literally forced ourselves like, hey, we're going to keep talking through this until we understand each other and it's all there.

7:01

And and it's so critical, you guys listening.

He's so critical.

You have to be able to disagree and stay calm and keep talking about it.

Even if you're passionate, you still need to control your emotions.

7:18

While we are going to be talking through parenting specifically, we do have to keep in mind this other aspect of it is one, you have to improve yourself as a person.

Two, you have to improve your marriage and your ability to communicate with each other if you really want to make the most progress possible on this topic of parenting.

7:37

But I do.

Remember, I want to emphasize that, so the more we work on us as a couple, the better we are as parents.

Yeah, and that's part of like the whole equation that we're talking about, like when I'm better and when you're better than we get better results.

And when our marriage is better than we get better parenting results.

Like it's all complementary and it all contributes to each other.

7:55

It's all it's holistic.

So.

But I do remember early on where, you know, especially when you're newlyweds, we wanted to avoid conflict.

We wanted to be happy all the time, Like, oh, things are great, we're happy, it's good.

And so if there was a subject that was sensitive or brought up negative feelings, it was like, oh, let's avoid that, let's not talk about that.

8:16

But that doesn't solve any problems.

That doesn't resolve the issue.

And many people can go years without ever touching on the subjects because they want to avoid the discomfort.

It's the skeleton in the closet.

And every time there's a new one like, oh, let's, let's say, let's just throw that in the closet and oh, here's another child and here's another situation.

8:33

Oh, let's just, let's keep avoiding that.

And eventually you've got an attic and several closets so full of skeletons and.

Then you're wondering.

Functioning and the kids are.

Terrible, wondering why you can't function and like everybody's walking on ink shells and it's like, well, cuz we're all trying to avoid the skeletons in the closet.

8:51

So I remember leaning into this of saying, well, wow, it's as uncomfortable as this is and how and how naturally I want to avoid it.

I learned that I learned to actually lean into that and to like go towards it when I noticed that there was something uncomfortable or that we were kind of avoiding.

9:11

I'm like, OK, that actually is the thing.

Let's talk about the thing.

Let's have the conversation, right?

Let's talk, babe.

Or you'd you'd send me a message at work and say, hey, when you go home, we need to talk, No.

9:27

Right.

But because we were both willing to engage in that process, it became very productive for us to grow and develop as a couple, as individuals, as a family, because we were willing to, and I would call them sometimes even breaking points, we were willing to breakthrough that barrier by leaning into the discomfort so that we could move ahead.

9:50

And it really is key like as until we are willing to do that, we do get stuck.

We're literally stuck.

We are blocked.

We're damned.

Like we cannot progress because we're not willing to move through that.

It just like Marcus really has said, the obstacle is the way, that thing that's standing in the way is the way to everything you want.

10:10

And I think, I think probably the most common problem is that when couples disagree, they get reactive.

And so they either implode or explode or they get so upset now they do the silent treatment, they run up, they, they're so emotionally attached to it that it turns into a fight and a separate, you know, a distance between them.

10:34

They get cold.

And so while it is challenging, we have to like stay in it.

So if we were going to approach something that maybe maybe Rachel's doing something with one of our children that I really don't like, we need to talk about that.

And and so I bring it up and then she gets defensive and reactive and I'm feel passionate about it.

10:54

So I start yelling and like they're the, the productivity of the conversation is already out the door.

So we stay calm and we're like, OK, we're both going to agree to stay calm here.

We're just going to, here's what I like to teach my clients that we're just going to set it on the table.

That's all we're doing.

11:10

You're going to set your perspective on the table.

I'm going to set my perspective on the table.

And we're just going to look at it.

And we don't have to come to any conclusions right now.

Nobody's being attacked, just set the dadgum thing on the table.

Well, I think it's fascinating also, and I don't know why this works, but it I think it does if you learn to operate from the framework as though you were you were this was taking place in a business setting And and for so many people, it's easy to do.

11:38

Oh, if I was at work, yeah, I would control myself.

I shouldn't be yelling at my my, I would say.

Colleague your bosses or whatever.

Like your wife is your boss, right?

I wouldn't be yelling at my colleagues, I would be controlling myself, and we wouldn't be having a conversation.

11:53

Even if it got heated or passionate, we would still maintain a form of decorum.

You can't get out of the boardroom and slam the door and run off like you're done.

You're fired.

Exactly right.

You can't scream yelling sold them like you're such an imbecile.

You're an idiot.

So no, you have to maintain yourself.

12:09

So if you can, do it at.

Work.

You can do it at home.

Do it at home.

Exactly.

And so we have that framework now.

We do have several podcast episodes about this already, so we'll link those in the show notes because we need to talk about today's topic, which is the parenting.

And you know, Greg and I have had many different little scenarios throughout our parenting years of raising seven children.

12:30

Well, actually we're still raising them because our youngest is 8.

And our oldest is not yet 25.

Yeah.

So we're still in it.

Prefrontal cortex is still developing and you know, we have disagreed on approaches and strategies, but ultimately we have been united in the parenting style that we use, which we're going to get to.

12:50

Even even more so, I'd say we were united in desired outcomes and maybe for philosophies, because there's been plenty of times when style has been different.

Yeah, well, and I'm using specifically the parenting style because that's what people call the four.

Parenting styles.

We're going to adjust, although that word is can be misunderstand stood because the style or the way we implement it can also be different, but I.

13:15

Remember that comes down to like an art and a science and personality and a technique.

So even inside of that are like, well, no, we're both using the same style, but the delivery could be very different.

So I guess we should use parenting approach and then unique styles, masculine, feminine and then the style will vary on each individual.

13:35

So, you know, there have been times when Greg has been disciplining a child.

And I will say I usually wait to say it till after, but I will say something like, well, I'm not sure.

I think that was too harsh or you said it, the tone was wrong or this or that or the other.

13:53

And we have been able to have those discussions of of.

Basically the way it goes is I say yes, dear, no, no, I you know, I'd say the the majority.

Self reflection includes self reflection, that willingness to self reflect so that when I bring something up or you bring something up to me, we are able to reflect and say either, yeah, you're right, I should have been softer, or do you know what?

14:22

No, I really felt like I handled it the way I needed to handle it in that moment.

And so if it's done well, like what you're talking about, you're like, hey, let's, let's take a look at what happened.

If it's done well, what it is is you're holding up a mirror.

Here's what it looked like.

14:39

And I can look at that and say, OK, I totally see what you're saying.

I was, I was blinded in the moment or you're right, I could have handled that better.

And I would say most of the time when when you offered a correction, I was like, yeah, you know, I could have done that better.

14:55

Thank you for pointing that out.

And then I make adjustment.

There's only been a few times where you came and, and your suggestion was so feminine that my response was, well, they, our kids don't need 2 moms.

And so I'm, I'm going to, in this, in this instance, I'm going to be the dad.

15:13

I'm going to do it the dad way and, and you do it the mom way.

And I'm not going to ask you to be more manly and masculine and, and be tough.

So that's not your role.

There's a few instances like, Nope, I'm, I'm going to be the man here.

Now, I do not want to be misunderstood.

There's like, well, I get a yell and I get to be harsh and mean because that's what men do.

15:33

That's not what I'm talking about.

Men are firm.

Sometimes blunt, especially with their sons.

Men can be frank and need to be and you know, to to create that structure and men can challenge.

15:51

That's, that's all.

Those are all great things, but it has to be done tactfully and well.

And I think the important thing to understand in this conversation is that one, we have space for that where we can say, you know what, these were my thoughts about how you handled that.

16:08

Now I don't.

Again, it's not happening in front of the kids.

It's happening behind closed doors.

Even even how you said that is is so important.

Yeah.

So you make it private and you say here here's some thoughts about what happened.

Instead of you do this, you suck or you did that wrong, you're terrible.

16:27

Even though there have been times when I've come to you say in passion, or I use the word passion because that means I have strong feelings about it.

Not like I'm raving lunatic type of passion.

You know, I come to you with strong feelings saying I feel really strong about that.

16:42

Like I don't think that that was right and we can have the conversation then.

The point being that if you in that process say to me, you know what?

No, I, I think I did handle it the right way.

Then I respect that because I know you are willing to correct yourself if I bring up a valid point again, because it's not about who's right, it's about what's right.

17:09

So when we both have that humility to be able to say, yeah, you're right.

I in fact, I know I was out of control or I was out of line, so I know I was wrong.

I'm going to go fix it.

I'm going to go apologize when that's happening.

Then we also have the space to say, do you know what?

17:25

No, I, I handled it well this time.

I did the right thing.

And then we can respect each other and say, OK, if you think that was right, great.

I'm I'm not.

I'm going to respect that and allow you to do it that way.

Yeah, one of one of your spouse's primary roles is to watch you do family life and offer feedback.

17:47

So please allow your spouse to hold up the mirror and and share their perspective.

It doesn't make them right.

Rachel's not right every time.

I'm not right every time just because, well, hey, I watch that, babe.

I doesn't make me right.

But we have to listen to each other.

18:03

And when we do, we can all be better.

I I think people get, I think they get really defensive, especially if I, if I blew up and I know it, I'm already mad at myself.

And then you tell me like, hey, you know, like I, I see this a lot with, with coaching class like you, you get, yeah, you just get defensive and sensitive about it.

18:23

Drop that crap.

Drop the eagle.

Especially with your spouse behind closed doors, that's the best time to drop the defensiveness.

Yes, but I would say even in front of the kids.

Well, and that often happens after behind closed doors with the spouse when you go out and you're like, OK, I'm sorry.

18:40

Yeah, I'm sorry.

I apologize.

I made a mistake.

But why can't I guess I'm going to hold up an ideal here.

If we model for our children in the moment, how to how to intervene, how to humbly acknowledge what's going on, have a self-awareness and situational awareness, how to take correction, how to apologize.

19:02

And they see the whole thing because I think sometimes to a fault, there's there's somethings hand, you know, the kids do something, whatever and it's handled wrong and nothing, nobody says anything until they go afterwards in private and they talk to you and they come back out and.

Then it's never dressed.

19:19

Everybody saw that it was handled wrong.

So what if we could repair it right there?

Like that's awesome.

Now, Austin was pretty hot headed and so it doesn't work.

But let's say, for example, Rachel is handling something wrong in the moment and everyone could see it.

19:36

It's happening.

It's not like the kids don't know it's happening.

And so I walk over and I maybe put a hand on her.

Say, sweetheart, take a breath.

Hold on.

Let's let's walk through this.

If in a moment like that, we as parents can be responsive and pause and take a breath and and say, OK, hold on.

19:54

Let's let's look at this differently.

That's that's amazing.

It is but.

We're handling in the moment and modeling for the kids how to do it.

Agree.

And I do think that that's definitely an ideal to work for because ultimately that's the point.

We want to show our kids how to be able to do these things so that they then have the tools to do them with their siblings when they become adults.

20:14

But I do want to say that if you're not there yet, OK, that's fine.

Go behind closed doors and and start there so that you can practice together.

Because for many, it's hard just to do that as a couple.

This you get because the other thing, and we're probably going to talk about it, is we also don't want to be modeling the wrong thing because then that's what leads to and for this, this is for a lot of families, the sibling rivalry and the fighting is happening because they're watching mom and dad do that.

20:43

They're being and now.

They're imitating it and exaggerating. 1%.

So it's better to practice behind closed doors until you get better at it.

And not so.

You can model the right thing.

Not be critical.

This is important so we can talk about without being critical.

20:59

Thank you for bringing that up.

That is so important.

If we are critical to each other and we are critical to the kids, they will be incessantly critical of each other.

Exactly right.

Oh, it'll be so ugly and.

Disturbing so, so we have to practice until we get better at that so we can model the appropriate thing.

21:19

OK, so the the first thing I want to emphasize.

Though many parents are afraid of of if they say something, they're undermining their authority, right And that's it's a sensitive thing and it's an important thing if.

If the other parents.

So if you say something to me, but I feel like you're undermining me or vice versa, like I can see how you might consider that to be a valid concern.

21:46

And, and depending on the dynamics, the kid might be like, I don't have to do what dad says because mom disagrees or, or vice versa, right.

And so you don't want that dynamic going on.

But I think that's why we're having this episode today is if they know you are united and that you're two different, very different people, but you're united and creating the same outcomes, they know they can't, they can't pick you apart and they can't run to one for one thing and to other.

22:14

And, and like nobody feels like there's any undermining of authorities.

I know we're, we're both trying to do the right thing.

We're focused on what's right, not who's right.

Yeah.

And so it, it isn't undermining my authority.

We're we're working towards the ideal solution.

22:29

Well, and it's also interesting that with that, with that shared unity, which is actually what we're going to talk about, the unity.

I, we do have the freedom to be able to say, well, wait a second, I, I see it this way.

And even to say that in front of the kids and it's not seen as belittling or undermining because they know that really what we're doing is we're just having a conversation to consider all sides of it so that we make the best choice right in front.

22:56

Of the other like again we're we're holding up ideals here Rachel.

I will disagree right in front of the kids respectfully.

I'm OK What about this what about that angle and the kids are sitting there like yeah what they what?

And they're watching US go back and forth and see it from different angles and try to come to a conclusion or even just like, well, we disagree on that.

23:19

Like front row seats for the kids to watch that happen, right?

It's incredible.

But we did practice for many years doing that behind closed doors so that we got better at it so we can do it in front of them.

Because leading into now where I want to start here is that the reason we're having this conversation is because there needs to be unity in the underlying approach to parenting.

23:46

Because otherwise, if you don't have that, kids feel insecure.

They they learn how to manipulate one parent or the other.

They learn how to divide you into like pitch you against each other.

Kids are smart and they can learn how to work the system And that like there's nothing wrong with that because that's actually just nature survival like it, it's just how humans work.

24:08

And I think we all do that to some degree.

So being but being on the same page or being or having the same approach doesn't mean that we have to approach or, or have the same style in the way that we implement the approach.

So we need to understand these differences here.

24:24

We can have the same approach and that's the words we're choosing to use, have the same approach and the style of implementation is going to be different for mom and dad, right?

But the ultimately that the unity, that's what provides the stability, that's what provides the the shared framework.

24:42

That's what provides the structure that gives the kids that certainty that they need so much in order to really thrive.

So that they get safety, they get assurance, they get this sense of like, OK, there are boundaries here, there's standards, it's clear, there's a unity.

24:59

Like I, I know what's expected of me.

And they want that.

They want to feel that they're in a place that there's some clear structure.

Right.

But then within that clear structure, there's going to be the variety that's also necessary because that's one of the things that's fascinating about humans.

25:20

And that, and that's also why I love the yin and Yang symbol, which I talk about all the time, is that we need this mixture of 1 feminine and masculine structure and chaos.

Like there has to be this balance or else if you have all structure and no chaos, that's damaging, that's traumatic even sometimes.

25:43

But if you have all chaos and no structure, that's also traumatic and damaging.

So you can't have just all one or the other.

There has to be this balance there.

So within, well, go ahead.

I just wanted the guys in my, in the formidable family man tribe, they love to do Saturday projects, right, where the whole family's working on things.

26:03

They have some land and they're up in Canada and they get things to do and, you know, and, and like, we're going to learn how to work as a family and we're going to do projects as a family.

And, and, and he, he just, he said, you know what the kids were like, let's do something fun.

He's like, OK.

26:18

And so they, they dropped all the chores and projects that we're going to do and they drove, you know, an hour over to a bigger town where they had this huge indoor water park and just magic and memories and awesome.

And and so, you know, the, the core philosophy of we're going to learn how to work and we get things up, but it complement that with absolutely fun, have fun, have memories, do great things and and have that balancing and it makes for really happy, healthy families.

26:46

Yeah.

In fact, I think that it's often those contrasting experiences that are the most beneficial for the development of children and families.

And I in our own life, we've experienced that again and again because we've lived a travel lifestyle.

But we've also learned that if it's all sitting on the beach all day long and just doing nothing, that is not good.

27:07

It's out of.

Balance.

That's fun once in a while, but if you do that all the time, it's out of balance and it's, it becomes demoralizing and like depressing in a way.

So you have to balance doing the work and then just having the the fun it's finished, especially some spontaneous fun like that.

27:24

So yeah, within this framework of we have a shared approach, It's great to have the inning, the masculine, the feminine and the different ways that mom and moms and dads parent and especially interact with children because we do interact with them differently.

27:43

And that's a good thing because it's helping to to develop their brain.

Left and right hemispheres.

Dads are roughhousing, they're playing, they're tickling, they're challenging them, they're pushing boundaries.

That is important.

That's critical for their development.

But then it's great for mom to be there and she's soothing and she's, you know, when the wrestling gets a little too rough, she's comforting and she's but if mom's there.

28:07

Well, it's going to happen.

Well, it is going to happen.

So you're going to roughhouse and someone's going to get hurt and and mom can be there, pick it up, not prevent it.

She's like, don't you dare roughhouse.

This is my house, is my sanctuary.

No roughness, no risk.

It's too far.

That is too much.

So mom's role in that situation is to be there to kind of pick up the pieces and kiss the Boo boos, but not to stop it from happening because then it's it's like we're talking about it comes out of balance and that's not healthy.

28:36

So then now the main.

Question can we pause to emphasize that and there there's a this is a big difference we see all the time.

Men need to lead their kids into risk, so to do risky things safely, and as uncomfortable it is for women and moms, they need to allow that to happen but also voice their things like, hey, don't, let's not be too risky.

28:58

Watch out for.

This beware of those things like, yeah, that we're there to balance each other, but that that's one that comes up all the time.

And for whatever reason, our society in general is at a stage of safety at all costs right now.

And it's not healthy.

It's not healthy for people because they become so risk averse in everything and they're so afraid of everything that the kid needs to wear cushions around him and only ride in, you know, only exist in circular padded rooms because we don't ever want anything to happen to the child.

29:31

And that's not healthy.

It's way out of balance.

Yes.

And part of the challenge I think in with parents not being on the quote UN quote same page is that they're not understanding the differences and then the necessary differences in their roles.

29:48

And so moms are wanting dads to be more like moms or the dad is wanting mom to be more like the dad.

Not recognizing or realizing that we each have a very important role and we need just respect each other's roles and, and realize that it's a role that's necessary and important and critical for the mental, emotional, physical development of your child, literally.

30:15

So that's the key.

But we do as different parents asking and feminine parents, we need to align on a philosophy.

We need to align on approach.

So now here's where I want to talk through.

30:31

There's four different main parenting philosophies or approaches and I want to go through them really quickly so that we can understand them.

And of course, I'm going to tell you there is one approach that is actually better than the others, and it's backed up by research like it is the gold standard of parenting approaches.

30:50

So it's the parenting approach that we all need to be using.

Makes sense too, as you'll see the.

One that works the best with children.

When you talk through it, you're like, OK, that makes sense.

Like that's, that's, I think as parents, that's how we want to be.

31:05

Exactly.

So I'm going to read them first and then I'm actually going to expand more on them after the first one is authoritarian, which is strict and fear based.

Leadership.

Or totalitarian.

But I would also say for many people, they just think that this is parenting, It's being the authority, which there's truth to that, but it it's a, it's the authority of like, because I said so, because I'm the boss, because I'm in.

31:31

Charge because.

I pay the bills.

I'm the boss, yeah, So I don't know any parents to be like, I'm the dictator.

Right, no one would say that, but they behave like dictators.

The boss.

Exactly.

So you're the boss dictator.

And and if you call it a dictator or a tyrant, you No, that.

31:48

Oh, I don't want to that's terrible.

That makes me feel bad.

I don't want to be that kind of person.

This is what's happening.

So you're the boss and you're very bossy.

Yeah, this you, you get reactions.

This is where you're using fear your threat.

I know I'm, I'm just, I'm getting into it because it's so good. 2nd permissive, which is lenient and inconsistent.

32:09

Third is neglectful.

You're literally disengaged or even abusing your well, abusive could be involved in that, but you're neglectful or you're absent, right?

Either physically or just mentally.

Yeah, exactly.

32:24

And then the last one is authoritative.

So as authoritative, you, you have lots of love.

You also have very high expectations and you have, that's why I'm using the word authority.

Again, you do have authority, but it's authority based on love as opposed.

32:41

Yeah, exactly.

So I guess people confuse often authoritarian and authoritative.

So let's go with authoritative is you have authority that you earn.

You have real influence from respect and love and results like your children looking to think, wow, this I want to be like that.

33:07

Harian is just make that connection.

It's bossy.

I'm bigger.

It's my way or the highway.

I I make the rules and you'll do what I say or else you're you're literally a tyrant dictator monster in your own home.

33:23

Even if you are a nice good person and you just want the good things for your kids.

Yeah, you can.

You can be an authoritarian out of good motives, but that doesn't change the fact that it doesn't work.

And so in case you haven't guessed, obviously it's authoritative parenting style that is backed by research to be the best parenting style or approach that is out there.

33:46

So let's let's talk a little bit more about each though, so that we can understand why they don't work, what it actually looks like in real life, you know, stuff like that.

I I would say in general, dads are going to lean towards authoritarian being the boss and moms are going to lean towards permissiveness.

34:07

And so it's the competition between gentle parenting and harsh parenting, either of which work.

They just don't work.

One of them raises weaklings and babies who think the world owes them something and they just want safety at all costs and and they want to be pampered and take care of.

34:27

They're very entitled on the authoritarian side.

Entitled or incapable in many ways.

Yes, very incompetent, very underdeveloped.

Yeah, they're just little babies.

They're grown babies on the the bossy side, the dictatorship.

34:45

Your words come in.

There's more competence there and.

And even some more results.

But it's buried in resentment and pain and very fixed mindsets.

35:01

Fear for sure.

Yeah, massive amounts of fear.

The the internal dialogue, the inner voice is shame, it's mean, it's harsh.

So you're just racked with torment.

But like, OK, so you got stuff done, you forced yourself through it, but you're not enjoying life.

35:22

Most of the people who grew up in environments like that, they don't like themselves.

And and then they end up, you know, passing that, yeah, they're passing that a law.

And they're not.

Yeah, you're right.

They're there.

It's just a lot of internal conflict there.

And and nobody, nobody likes to be controlled.

35:42

And so an authoritarian is the the boss, the dictator.

It's controlling and no child, no person wants to be controlled.

They don't.

And so with the authoritarian style, it's a it's high control and low warmth.

35:59

It's almost because I feel that.

I would say low respect too.

Well, right, low respect for the child.

And then of course that's not reciprocated.

They have low, the, the child has low respect for the parent because of that.

But the I think the warmth aspect is important because there's not a lot of that soft warm feelings because in order to be an authoritarian, you almost have to keep the cold demeanor because otherwise if you don't, it's like you feel you're going to be taken advantage of.

36:30

Which you will.

Be that you're going to be, you know, the rules are going to be pushed, the boundaries are going to be pushed.

For sure, because you haven't earned.

I guess another way to see this.

We're trying to give you all the different angles.

You're not a leader, you're a boss.

And people don't respect their bosses and leaders are leaders because people want to follow them.

36:49

That's true leadership where as soon as the boss turns back, we're going to do the opposite.

And so the boss, like I have to keep being harsh because they'll take advantage of the rebel or, or they'll be soft and weak and spoiled.

I'm not going to let my kids be spoiled little brats.

And so I'm, I'm going to have to be the boss.

37:07

And, and I think the vast majority of people operate between those first two, you know, the dictatorship or the passivity, there's oscillating and they don't know there's other options like I'm not let them do whatever they want.

How do I get them to do it?

I have to force them to do it.

37:23

Right.

So they're they're very strict.

They're demanding obedience from their children, which you know, we could do a whole podcast episode about how obedient children is not a good thing.

It's not good for your kids to be obedient, and they rarely.

We can't just leave that hanging.

We've done episodes on it because we're like, wait, what?

37:41

I I thought obedience was the goal, The real goal, the ultimate ideal, like the best outcome, is that your children on their own, learn how to make good decisions and then make good decisions.

37:58

They do the right thing for the right reason on their own.

Whether or not you're there or not.

There, there may be no authority figure around.

You might not be there.

Nobody's there to tell them what to do.

They think through it.

They make the right decision, they hold themselves to standard.

38:14

That's the goal.

And that is the opposite, not the opposite.

But it's very different from just merely being obedient.

Well, you in fact, you can't get to that outcome if obedience is the main goal.

If you're told to obey no matter what, without questioning, without debate, then you're not learning to think, you're just learning to follow orders.

38:35

And that does not produce that outcome you just described.

But part of authoritarian parenting is that they don't explain why the rules exist.

They don't explain the reasoning, but which is part of this whole obedience thing.

They're not explaining why I want you to keep the rule.

38:52

You're not explaining why you need to do this thing.

It's just because I said so.

You're supposed to obey and that is not healthy.

If you want to raise well adjusted kids, that does not work.

Will not work, especially because the kids will be grossly underdeveloped.

39:07

Right.

And and often the parents don't explain it.

Because they can't making their their thinking is underdeveloped.

And and that's being inherited from the parents who haven't thought through it can articulate it.

So they're like, we'll just do what I said.

And the kid says, well, why?

Because I said so that's why they're like, well, I would love to be there in that moment and be like, well, hold up, parent.

39:28

Why?

Yeah, see if you can articulate this, right?

Why 8:30 bedtimes, please back this up.

What is it about those 3 numbers 830?

That is the magic formula, yeah.

For parenting.

Exactly.

It's an arbitrary number out of your.

39:45

Number remember.

Cavity somewhere.

Come on, this is ridiculous.

I remember when my kids were young because again, we started off questioning a lot of things, questioning the norms and the conventions.

And I remember telling my kids like, get off the table, stay off the table.

40:00

You shouldn't be off the table on the table, even though kids of course love, love it to climb on the table.

And I remember them asking me why.

You know, and of course we were in this beginning, this phase of like explaining to them and helping them to understand.

40:16

I remember thinking, well, why?

Why can't they get on the table?

And so I had to think through it.

And then I actually came to a conclusion that at least in my mind, worked for me of like, well, I guess there's not a great reason except for during certain times when we are, let's say, eating, that's when I don't want you on the table.

40:36

If we've got food on the table and we're going to eat, I don't want you on the table because we're trying to eat and I don't want your feet.

I don't want this.

That's what I mean by don't get on the table.

But if the table is clear and we're not eating, great I guess.

And you want to climb up there and jump off it and build a cool Fort and great you.

40:53

Can be on the table and so, but the powerful thing of that, too, is that it helps kids to learn that life is more than just black and white.

It's more than just never get on the table because it's one or the other.

They they realize there's complexity and nuance and there's different situations where you have different rules and that's OK.

41:12

That's actually a good thing.

And that's a more mature way of viewing the world because it helps you to understand that those situations apply lots of different.

Places 100% there.

There's an exception to almost every rule.

Right.

41:28

It's true.

And so you actually want to teach your kids that there are exceptions to the rules.

And maybe the best example of that is in the Bible.

The the Bible is just a book of contradictions.

Exactly.

And as you read too, I'm like, OK, no, this, this is powerful.

It's important, right?

Like there are exceptions.

41:45

So then as mom and dad, as we're parenting, like, let's teach our kids how to think.

Yeah.

And, and to understand that there are exceptions sometimes, and here's why, and here's why it would be an exception.

And so we have to learn how to think about when are the exceptions and when do we follow the rules.

42:00

And that's, that's true authority, right on the best form of parenting, true authority is when I've thought through something and I can explain it to a child at their level.

So they get it and they can repeat it back to me and they they can agree.

There's like, yeah, I, I see what you're saying.

42:15

And that makes sense to me.

And so I'm no longer going to fight you on that thing.

We don't have to have a battle because I'm in.

That's the real power there, because when you can explain something to your child well enough that they get it, and they then choose to opt in and keep the rule because it makes sense to them, that's where you have real power.

42:34

That's the power of authoritative parenting.

There's no more battle.

As opposed to with authoritarian parenting where you you, you focus on punishing them if they don't keep the rules, or threatening them to keep the rules, or bribing them to keep the rules.

42:50

That doesn't work because it's all externally motivated instead of internally motivated.

Well, and you just brought up some really important under the authoritative or the bossy, the dictator.

There's lots and lots and lots of rules.

Too many rules, so many.

43:06

It's rules for everything.

Your your unwritten rule book for your family is massive.

And guess what?

Human beings hate rules.

They absolutely hate rules.

And so, and they intuitively know that there are exceptions to the rules.

Right.

Kids know that even if they can't articulate it to you, they understand that somehow.

43:25

So in our family, as as we were going through this though, like why, why have so many rules?

Why, why all the rules is not helpful.

Let's have standards, let's have boundaries.

Let's operate by principles and let's talk through it as a family.

43:41

Let's let's decide how do we want to do life together?

What's the what's the better way?

And then everyone agrees like, Oh yeah, well, this is the better way.

Let's do that and we don't have to have a rule.

We don't have to have 10 rules around that dumb thing.

It sounds like a government, gash.

Like one of the worst things you can do is run your family like a government.

44:00

This is the most inefficient, ineffective thing on the flippant planet and everybody hates it because they just have 10,000 rules for everything.

So that's the authoritative side.

Well.

And sorry, authoritarian.

Right.

And so when we get to authoritative, I want to dive into that a little bit more so people can understand the difference between a boundary or standard and a rule, because I'm sure there's some confusion there, but but I also want to go through this some more.

44:26

So of course, an authoritarian because we touched on it like the emotional connection is limited because we're we're not focused on connecting with our child as much as we are on controlling our child.

We want them to obey the rules and follow the rules because we think that that's how you.

I'm here to tell them what to do.

44:42

Right.

And so kids often can appear well behaved or like good kids, but they are going to struggle with self esteem.

They're going to struggle with shame, guilt.

Like we mentioned, they're operating out of fear based motivation.

44:59

And of course, later they often rebel.

In fact, if they don't rebel while they're living in your home, they're probably going to rebel.

At least turn away from many of your standards when they get older.

Because they just thought I hated it the whole time.

So you can have obedient and anxious children, but they're going to be resentful.

45:16

Yeah, the relationship almost always suffers tremendously under this parenting approach.

And we, because we work with a lot of parents, I mean, we see this all the time, parents who use authoritarian, the authoritarian approach.

45:32

They have children who resent them, who rebel, who even sometimes hate them because they have been so heavy-handed.

OK, The second one, though, permissive.

And this could be summarized as something like, well, I just want them to be happy.

So I'm going to let them do what they want so they can be happy.

45:50

It's low control.

There's lots of warmth.

This is kind of the gentle parenting of like, oh, I'm just here.

I'm.

Going to let my kids choose because they know best.

Let them just We literally just heard this again recently.

I'm just going to let my kids decide what's best for them and.

Anyone who says that literally has no earthly idea about child development, right?

46:10

Child Psychology.

Like you have no idea what's happening in your child's brain and what they're capable of.

They need clear structure and boundaries because otherwise it feels unsafe.

It feels frightening.

It's the whole idea.

People don't realize that this is actually a thing.

And I'm going to use this kind of a silly story, but I remember because we created a life that allowed us to live and work from anywhere because we worked online.

46:35

I remember during one time in our our life when we were trying to decide what to do and I felt so overwhelmed because there were no constraints on how to decide.

Like we weren't going to move.

We were looking at the entire globe trying to decide where should we live and what should we do.

46:54

And I remember thinking like, this is overwhelming.

Like, how do I decide if I moved to Thailand or or Argentina or, you know, and people probably think, well, that's so silly, but it was this idea of all constraints being removed.

I'm not moving there for a job.

I'm not moving there because there's family.

47:10

I'm not.

There were no reasons to move anywhere or not move anywhere.

So.

When you have no clear constraints like that, it's actually overwhelming.

And and so I'm using this with this idea of child psychology is you literally remove all boundaries from your child.

47:27

It's not freeing.

It's terrifying, right?

That's how they feel with no boundaries.

They need to have clear standards, clear expectations, clear boundaries so they feel safe.

That's what they need.

But with permissive parents, they're indulgent, they avoid conflict, and so they will just let them do whatever is a supposed to conflict with them in order to hold those boundaries.

47:49

And I think it's important right there to point out that kids will test boundaries they they have.

To That's their job.

They're going to go, you're going to say, hey, don't do that.

They're going to do it and you think you've just rotten evil little monster.

It's like, no, that's that's just part of being live.

You're going to test boundaries because they want to know is it really a boundary?

48:07

And so.

Or with the permissive style, if you think, Oh well, that just, it must just mean that that's what they need.

They need to live beyond those boundaries, so I'm not going to enforce the rules.

And be on their screens all the time.

They're pushing the boundaries because they need to know where the boundary is.

48:23

They need to feel that security and that safety of like, oh, OK, here's here's the fence.

Kind of like when you have cows, right?

They're pushing to see where's the fence.

OK, Now when I know where the fence is, now I can operate comfortably, safely, securely, because I know what the limits are.

Exactly.

But if, if they don't have those boundaries, they there's also no accountability.

48:46

They they can't develop accountability, they can't develop responsibility because there's no boundaries.

Like it's literally impossible to do that if you don't have boundaries and expectations in place.

So they can feel loved from you still, but they're going to feel anxious, they're going to feel insecure.

49:03

They're going to feel kind of like I was telling with my little story.

They're going to feel like, how do I manage my world because it's too big, It's too large for me to grasp and to try to make clear decisions in right.

So and then they also, of course, struggle with with authority figures, but I think they also struggle with their own individual authority.

49:27

They're they're going to be lacking in that confidence of like, yes, I'm going to be certain and clear and.

Interactive and active, and so they're not going to be very productive or effective or self.

Exactly.

So the result of this approach is the kids often have poor impulse control.

49:45

They cannot control their emotions, they can't control their desires or wants.

There's entitled, they're spoiled, and they struggle with not only following structure in society in general, but in maintaining their own structure.

50:01

So, and that's going to lead to like mental illness.

Yes, holding their own standards and setting goals and targets and achieving them and, and setting up habits and routines and setting boundaries for themselves.

So like, no, I'm not going to eat that stuff and I'm not going to stay up all night playing games like.

Because there's like, there's no point in not doing that.

50:19

Like why should I have any rules or expectations at all?

And we see, we see this often with both parents, moms or dads can be very permissive for whatever reason.

Maybe something the way I think it's.

In response to the more authoritarian parent, they're being more permissive.

50:42

So it's a reaction.

Balance that out, but.

So if Mama, if Mama's very I'm the boss, the dad will become quite permissive and passive, and vice versa.

But that does not produce well adjusted outcome.

OK, neglectful is some is this is more like I'm just too busy.

51:04

I'm just too busy deparing you, whether it could be intentional, unintentional.

Life is chaotic.

You're dealing with your own issues and so you just don't have time for your kids.

There's low control, low warmth.

And and you heard this.

You immediately think those are, those must be the bad people.

51:23

They must be bad parents that are negligent.

Like, how terrible.

Who would do that?

But the reality is that's happening so much today.

Yeah.

Because of distraction and chaos.

Devices screen time.

Overloaded lives, Yeah.

51:41

So we have so many screens, we have so many activities.

And in an effort to be a good parent, we have our kids enrolled in everything right?

And we get them the latest and greatest of devices and stuff and.

51:57

Things and as the mom, we're driving them everywhere, taking them here and there.

And so it in intent, unintentionally, we've become a neglectful parent because we are just so busy, so overwhelmed, so unavailable for them that there's no time for us to sit and talk to her child because we've got to go here now.

52:17

We've got to go there.

And so it's almost.

So we're not, we're not with them, Yeah, it seems like.

Definitely not mentally and emotional.

You're the taxi driver.

Physically be with them, but you're not there mentally and emotionally because you're worrying and thinking about this could just because from worry you're stressed and worried about everything else and so you're emotionally unavailable because you just can't, you can't handle it. 100% yeah.

52:41

Or you're dealing with neighborhood drama or church drama.

Or family drama.

Yeah, extended family drama.

So you actually become a negligent parent because you're so worried about something happening with your in laws or your siblings or whatever.

You know when you're at at the PTA or this organization or your choir and your sports.

53:01

Helping everyone else, but not your children, because yeah, you're too busy for that.

Drop the hammer on this one.

Because it does.

When you think about neglectful parenting, you do tend to think of some abusive person or some person who never wanted to have kids.

53:19

But it's not that.

It's often good intentioned parents who are good people but literally just are mentally emotionally checked out because they're so worried and busy with so many other things.

So the mental loads too big.

Dads do this a ton by pursuing business.

53:36

We see this all the time with business owners, entrepreneurs or businessmen.

Dad becomes a neglectful.

Parent, he's not there.

He's trying to climb the ladder and he's doing it quote for his family and he really wants to be financially successful.

So he's chasing it down and I see this all the time.

They're making good money, but they're neglectful parents, right?

53:54

He's he's just not there.

It's not enough quantity time and he'll even bring work home.

And even if he's trying with him, he's thinking about the next business deal or the negotiation or what went wrong.

He's worried about his partners and his employees.

He's worried about his team and his patients.

54:10

He's he's all.

And so it's like he becomes a neglectful parent trying to be a really good provider.

And I think it's important to point out that we can, as parents, be a combination of these as well, depending on the situation.

So we could be this neglectful parent and then when we are with our kids, then we're authoritarian or permissive.

54:29

I I did want to point that out and really emphasize that hopefully as you're listening, you're like, Oh yeah, I've done, I've done, I've been the boss one or the other and the dictator and I've been permissive and I've been neglectful.

And you're like probably at times been authoritative.

54:44

I've done all three today, every day, and it might be in certain aspects.

I've seen this too.

It's like waiting on the thing.

With food, you're very a dictator and with screens, you're permissive and with, you know, quality time together listening, you're totally neglectful.

55:05

And and you just set into this this pattern and there it is.

You just do it every day.

You're all three and it's not working.

OK, back to neglectful though.

Basic needs.

So neglectful doesn't mean you're like letting your child starve in the street or something.

55:23

Basic needs can be met, met, but there's little guidance, There's little connection.

You're not like super involved in your child.

And again, there's a balance here.

You don't have to be the helicopter parent like hovering all the time and involved with everything.

That's also not healthy, but there needs to be connection there.

55:41

So you're not, you're not doing things for them, ideally, you're doing things with them and you're being.

That's why, that's why our parenting, our new parenting course is so critically important because it's parent mentoring and the mentor mentoring your kids is the opposite of being neglectful.

56:05

So neglectful parenting is like what I I pay the bills, they have a house, you know, I tell them I love them, they're good.

What's the problem?

Here, let me live my life.

Because you're not involved.

You're so caught up in your own life, in your own stuff and things.

Or you, you just walk in as like, kid, be good.

56:21

I'll tell you what to do.

But you're not coaching them, you're not mentoring them, you're not guiding them.

And so it's, it's negligence.

Right.

And we've had parents even to ask us like I get bored hanging out with my kids.

Like I, I don't want to hang out.

56:38

I don't want to spend time with them.

It's just not interesting.

And that's a form of neglect because and it's not their fault.

It's your fault if they're boring and you can't find anything to do with them.

And two, you're their parent.

So that's your job, to mentor them, to be there and guide them.

56:56

If they're annoying or if whatever, if for whatever reason you don't like your kids or you like being with them, that's on you, man.

Yes, that is on you, right?

And so mentor your kids, get involved to help them become people you love spending time.

With SO with neglectful parenting, obviously kids end up feeling abandoned or lonely or that they have to raise themselves because their parents are too busy.

57:17

They often can have poor self regulation, attachment issues of course and a low self worth.

So finally to authoritative, which is the old standard this.

Was so many times.

We, Rachel, are going to meet with adults every day and with adults 30s, forties, fifties, 60s, we are still hearing about how they struggle because their parents were one of these three ineffective things.

57:49

Like I had to do everything because my mom was never there.

And you know, on and on.

Like it's, it drags through life with them.

This stuff lasts decades.

It's, it is not just a temporary small thing.

This is not insignificant.

58:05

Right.

And I think too few parents realize that because one, now that they are parents, they're finally realizing the lasting impact their childhood has on them now.

And so as a result, 2, they're not being intentional enough about how they're raising their children to try to give them as much of as an advantage as possible.

58:31

OK, Authoritative.

Authoritative is firm and kind.

Beautiful.

Which is possible.

You can be firm and you can be kind.

There's high control, meaning there's order expectations, there's order, there's standards, but there's also high warmth.

58:48

There's lots of love, there's lots of fun, there's lots of playfulness, right?

It's not cold, distant authoritarianism.

So parents set clear expectations like, you know, they know Exactly.

And so we should talk about this because we mentioned, oh, well, the difference is you have expectations or standards or boundaries, but not rules.

59:12

Is there a specific example you want to?

Give.

It's so subtle and so important here because when when you say it's authoritative, which is the good one in that their their expectations, the authoritarian starts thinking, well, that's what I do.

I have all, all of my expectations are very clear.

59:29

I have rules for everything I expect.

You to yeah do this.

But it's not working because it on the surface it looks similar, the authoritarian and authoritative it looks similar, but there are subtle differences that are very significant.

59:46

Well, the best way I think I can mentally picture this in my mind because it is difficult to grasp in a lot of ways, but I see it as, and in fact, you drew it out the other day and I thought it was perfect because at first I was seeing, well, it's like a fortress with these four walls.

1:00:03

And but then you drew it out and was like, here, it's kind of messy and all over the place.

But the wall is still there.

It's like, OK, this is allowed, but this isn't allowed.

And that's here in the church, you know, So it's a little bit more flexible and organic, as family life often is.

1:00:21

Family life is not just.

Rigid straight lines. 90° angles, you know, that's not family life.

So in some ways the boundaries are a little bit parking.

Yeah.

And it looks, it looks odd.

And you're like, wait a minute, you don't allow that, but you do allow that, that that doesn't make any sense.

1:00:40

And you're like, well, it makes perfect sense when we walk through it and explain it, understand it.

Oh, well, yeah, no wonder.

And then wait a minute, you got a hard line there.

But then over here you have a gate.

And and the gate, you can open the gate.

Yeah, of course you can.

But it's a privileged gate.

1:00:56

And so if we live by the standard, then we get to open the gate and we get access to that thing.

But otherwise, that gate stays closed.

So it's not a, you know, 100 foot wall that's never available.

And we have these, you know, scary, threatening, terrible things.

1:01:12

That's very dictatorship.

And maybe the the simplest example to give at this moment is going back to my table analogy.

Like if you have a rule that you don't get on the table, that's hard and fast.

It's black and white.

1:01:27

And so of course when the child gets on the table, which every parent who has that rule knows their child is going to get on the table.

Like you just know even if you don't.

And then when it happens, you freak out as though.

1:01:43

I told you.

How?

How could you dare get on the table?

That's our friend.

That's that's when the real problems come.

Like that's what causes the breaks in relationships, in family life, because we have these hard and fast rules and when our Children Act like children, we get upset that they behave that way.

1:02:05

So.

We create a battle and now there's a rift between us.

It it becomes it's this drama and it's painful and there's this real withdrawal in the relationship.

It really hurt.

And it was all because because you set a dumb rule.

Well, right, A rule that based on how the world really works, cannot be kept 100% of the time because.

1:02:29

Children are children, and especially if your rules go against the nature of children.

I think that's important to emphasize.

So and if your dictator boss.

Let me just say real quick, if your rule requires that children behave like adults.

1:02:45

Yeah, your rules don't.

That is not healthy.

And so that that is part of this difference between rules and standards is that in a standard it's age appropriate.

So you behave at your age level, but within certain appropriate boundaries, right.

1:03:04

So then we go back to the table and you know, I didn't have a rule about you don't get on the table.

But I did have an expectation that we have good manners when we're eating, which includes not getting on the table.

And so when they would get on the table, which inevitably they do because they're kids, authoritarian.

1:03:22

Could happen during dinner.

The the boss or the dictator tyrant screams, yells, punishes.

It makes an ugly scene and it's like everybody feels like crap.

The authoritative, which is the positive.

Who's holding the standard?

Walks over and grabs them and says hey remember.

1:03:40

We don't get on the table during dinner.

We don't get up there, so come on down.

And they do it again.

Nope.

Hey, come on, come here.

And if you do it again, you're not going to be allowed to sit near the table.

You'll have to sit over.

There and the actual consequence, right.

1:03:55

I'm not going to be like you're grounded or you're going to time out or no.

It's like it's, it's authoritative, which is the good one has very natural consequences instead of instead of punishments, natural consequences.

1:04:11

So if you keep getting on the table while we're eating, then I'm going to back your chair up.

So you can't reach the table.

So you can't reach the table, so you don't get to use the table.

You have to sit right over here.

You're still with us.

You still get to eat.

You're still part of the family.

There's a natural consequence.

1:04:26

I just had to distance you from the the thing you were doing.

And I'm I'm calm, not upset.

I'm correcting the behavior.

I'm teaching, I'm mentoring, I'm guiding and I slip them away instead of hard rule.

I will scream and yell and spank your butt and make a big scene and and you're gonna cry and everyone's gonna feel like crap.

1:04:45

Right, 'cause I just ruined the whole dinner.

Exactly because we have a rule in our family that we all sit down together and have dinner together.

But the problem.

And then dinner sucks and all of your kids hate sitting down to a meal with you because you're a dictator and a tyrant.

1:05:00

The problem is, and the irony is that in that scenario, many parents blame the child absolutely.

They say the child is the one that ruined the dinner because they wouldn't obey me and kept getting on the table.

Oh my goodness.

So.

So parents are blaming children.

1:05:17

For being children.

For being children while they're simultaneously not being the adult and taking responsibility for the situation.

Oh, the irony.

Yes.

So being the adult in the family does not mean being the boss in the family, right?

1:05:33

It means being the leader.

Yeah.

And and it emphasizes like you were, you just explained in that scenario that discipline is rooted in teaching, not in punishment.

Yes, yes, yes.

Because especially because what else you would do in that scenario is you would talk to them again and remind them, hey, remember, look at your feet or look at your shoes.

1:05:53

They're dirty.

You were just outside today.

You were running on the street.

I don't want the dog poop and the dirt from outside on my table, especially while we are eating.

And so you're, you're teaching them why?

Why is this a thing?

So that they're like, oh, OK, yeah, you're right.

1:06:10

I did step in dog poop.

I don't want to get that on the table.

I should not get on the table, right?

The teaching is the key element there.

Because otherwise, going back to the whole idea of just blind obedience, they're not actually learning.

They're just learning to keep rules out of fear.

1:06:27

Well, and they're not learning how to think and they're not learning how to make good decisions on their own, right.

Where?

The Write this down, memorize it, internalize it.

The absolute best form of discipline is teaching.

Yes.

1:06:43

And many parents will say, well, I just don't have time for that.

I just like I need to get dinner done so I can go do this right, do this thing or take care of that.

And so they think, well, this takes more effort, it takes more work, it takes more thinking.

Instead of they get punished right away for breaking the rule and it's done.

1:07:02

I have to do this multiple times and I have to say it multiple times.

But what they don't realize is that the one process is again, emphasizing fear, emphasizing obeying without questioning, which does not develop critical thinking skills or, well, I mean, ultimately it's not.

1:07:27

It's not creating emotional intelligence and individual awareness, right?

Because they're not taught to pay attention to their own bodies or their own thoughts or their own emotions.

They're taught to just do what the authority figure tells them, which is unhealthy.

1:07:45

Simultaneously, they're not taught to pay attention to themselves or their surroundings or others.

Yes, situational awareness.

When you, when you put an arm around and be like, here, take a look at that and notice that and see that.

So with what you see right here, what would be the best behavior?

1:08:00

And kids are sharp.

They're like, oh, it'd be this and this like exactly.

So now you notice it.

Now you know what to do instead of I tell you what to do, obey.

And, and they're like, I don't even understand why, because you didn't teach them how to have that awareness.

And so when you use the authoritative style, you're teaching them autonomy, you're teaching them how to think through situations, and you're teaching them to be intelligent mentally, emotionally, socially, as opposed to just, well, I'm used to just doing what someone tells me to do and otherwise, I don't have a clue which we've seen that with families.

1:08:33

I want to emphasize what you're saying there.

With time, if we teach and mentor our kids, it will take a lot of extra minutes, a lot that'll turn into hours.

If we don't, guaranteed there will be hundreds and thousands of hours you spend later in life trying to repair horrible things that have happened.

1:08:57

And it's goes into the hundreds of thousands of dollars and thousands of hours pleading, praying, desperately doing anything to try to get your kids to make good decisions when you could have prevented all of that with a few extra minutes here and there every day teaching them how to sink.

1:09:18

And that's something that I, I just want to somehow drill into parents heads so they understand that framework because they are, they're so willing.

Well, no, they're not willing to invest that time because it feels like an inconvenience.

1:09:34

It feels like it's extra effort, but they don't realize that they're going to be paying for it either way.

You're paying upfront or you're paying on the back end with trying to fix things.

It's way more worth it to pay upfront with the extra effort because as a result you end up raising well adjusted kids.

1:09:51

Or they're confident, they're capable, they know how to think, they know how to make decisions.

Like that's the outcome that you get when you're willing to make those authoritative investments.

Beautiful.

OK, so the topic today was getting on the same page as.

1:10:06

Yes.

So back to that.

Dad So listening to this podcast together is great discussing those 4 philosophies or what do we call them?

Not approaches.

We're calling it approaches.

And philosophy and I'd, I'd be hard pressed to, if you walk through those four and you understand them to that one of you be like, Nope, I'm going to be the dictator or I'm going to be permissive or let's be, let's be neglectful together.

1:10:33

Spouse, like no duh.

So you, you start there and you're like, well, yeah, let's be authoritative.

So let's, let's make sure we have clear rules and standards and boundaries.

Let's enforce them kindly.

We can be firm and kind at the same time.

That's the best way to do it.

Everyone loves that.

1:10:49

And it's, well, let's do that.

And so then, then you start going through specific things.

You're like, well, in our family, like we want people to be readers and we want to be healthy.

So go through and like it.

Can also begin by starting with some of the rules you already have.

1:11:08

And if you know, especially if one parent was like, well, you have this rule and I disagree, that's a great place to start for you to say, well, does this need to be a rule?

Or does it just need to be like, I'm teaching the standard or the, the, the philosophy behind it?

Like with the table example, you know, so that you, you both understand.

1:11:26

And I think that that's a level of mental and emotional maturity that we have to gain as parents.

We understand that there is nuance here.

It's not black and white.

It's not just you never do the same or you or you get punished, right?

So if not that simple.

1:11:42

If we were doing this and, and, and I want to kind of almost model it or role play it so that people know how to do this.

So let's say you have a hard rule and, and I just, I don't, I don't get it.

And so I'd be like, babe, you have this really hard rule for the kids and you, you get after them if they're off, like tell me, tell me why.

1:12:02

And so then you explain to me why it's so important to you.

I'm like, OK, thank you.

Thank you for explaining it.

Like I, I get that.

I, I kind of see it differently.

I don't think it's as important, but I, I totally understand why you see it that way.

Let's talk about how we could teach it as a principal or a standard and and have it, but not have it be one of those hard rules where we have to dictate.

1:12:30

Well, that's what I would do right there.

Yeah, and I can actually in my mind, think of an example because, and this, this is something I think a lot of moms can relate to.

I personally would love to have a rule where everyone loads their dish in the dishwasher after every meal, but I have learned that I have to be very flexible on that because one, it's not always feasible.

1:12:55

The dishwasher is not always ready to be loaded 2.

There's going to be things that are happening.

Two well.

So unrealistic.

That's it.

That's another thing too, that because of the nature of family life, we've always got and the fact that we have this resort where we have lots of families and things going on, there's always something going on because of #1 the dishwasher is not ready.

1:13:17

If the dishwasher was ready every single day at as soon as everyone was finished with their meal and all they had to do was put it in there, that would be one thing, right?

But that's not the case because family life is not like that.

It's more complicated.

There's more that's happening.

So what I have settled on instead is.

1:13:34

Let me interject.

So then, then a mom would think, well, I need more rules.

We have to have rules about somebody needs to unload the dishwasher before we eat any meal, and that means somebody needs.

And so now she's got 20.

Rules be an approach, but that often ends up in more stress and more control and more forcing.

1:13:55

So what I have landed on is all I care about is that 5 to 6 days out of the week the dishes get washed, that they get, the dishwasher gets run and unloaded.

You know that the next phase of cleaning the dishes happens.

1:14:12

And currently that happens best and easiest when our 14 year old son does it.

And he has to listen to his audio book.

He has taken does the dishes.

He's essentially taken responsibility of this role.

He enjoys doing it.

It happens every single day.

And so if people don't load their dish in the dishwasher and they just put it in the sink, I'm not sitting there stressing about it because I want this rule of you have to put your dish in the dishwasher because that doesn't work for everybody.

1:14:39

But this does work.

So I guess that's an idea of how here I have the standard of, yeah, I'm not going to let dishes pile up and sit there for weeks.

That never happens, ever.

That's the standard.

Or even days like not going to happen.

Did did I say weeks?

I meant days.

1:14:55

That never happens.

Dishes get washed every single day.

But there's the.

Standard is we want to clean the kitchen the.

Rule was what I'm saying.

You know, if I was strict and controlling, the rule would be no.

Everyone loads their dishes immediately after the meal.

1:15:12

That just doesn't work.

It's not realistic plus not real.

I want to place them out.

Unless maybe you had like two kids.

Maybe so many parents sacrifice the better things for the small things.

1:15:27

So they might set up that hard rule of like when we're done, absolutely have to put the dishes away.

And so that interrupts like this beautiful family bonding where one's sitting around enjoying each other, talking, having meaningful conversations.

1:15:44

Right, we have to get to the next.

Connecting so the thing you most is this bonded loving family.

But blasted I've got to interrupt what I want most because I have this rule and so we're sacrificing relationships for a dumb rule.

Which I think is very fascinating that you brought that up because because we have launched to the first cohort the Extraordinary parent mentoring method course.

1:16:09

And I've been going through all the intake forms and reading people and what they're struggling with and what they want to get, what they want to achieve in their family.

And it's interesting to me because that was one of the things I thought of so many of the moms who filled this out said what I want more of is more joy, more peace, more laughter, more fun that my kids Remember Me as being there and being involved.

1:16:34

But what they're struggling with most is getting their kids to do chores and to do the things and to pick up.

So it's almost like this incongruence.

They want more being, but they're trying to focus on more doing to achieve the being.

It doesn't work that way.

Being requires you to be in the moment without an agenda, without a schedule, without a plan.

1:16:56

That's what being is about.

Doing is something different now.

Can we get our kids to be more helpful with the doing part?

Yes, of course.

But we have to allow ourselves to be in the being part without having all the the SUS to get done.

1:17:15

And so we have this conflict.

Yeah, they're in between.

All the rules we have in our heads.

So every single one of us has a rule book in our heads that just got built over a year.

So it's this unconscious rule books of a real book in your head of how you think things should be.

And we're often letting the rule book disrupt the things we really want, right?

1:17:32

And so we have to learn how to get them to work together.

And so we can have both.

It and because I, because I am a mom and I understand how we think it's almost like in our minds, we think, well, I'm going to get everybody to do the chores and the rules 1st.

1:17:48

And then after they've done that, then we can sit around and do this beautiful being and enjoying not realizing that they actually, especially if that happens naturally, which it does.

If they interrupt yet they're not going to get back to it because they have interrupted the flow.

1:18:07

They've interrupted the beauty.

They've interrupted the joy by trying to.

It's like Mary and Martha in in the Bible.

You know, they've interrupted that beauty of being in the presence of something amazing to try to get the things done.

The checklist.

It doesn't work that way.

It can't.

1:18:24

And so we have to make exceptions to our rules.

Right.

Like the loading the dishwasher thing.

I make an exception to that because I know, do you know what?

We're all going to sit around here, We're going to enjoy, we're going to talk, we're going to be together and later my 14 year old will wash all the dishes and it will get done.

1:18:41

And here's here's another approach.

You you stay in it and and you have to settle your mind because your your mind starts freaking out.

I have a rule that just need to get done.

If they don't, I won't be able to go to bed tonight and then I won't sleep in the morning.

I'll be if.

You have, you know, younger kids or they you know, they're not capable to helping out.

1:18:59

You're thinking I'm going to get stuck with all the work I'm going to do and I we can do whole podcast.

About that, but if we stay in the moment, enjoy the beauty of the wonder and then as it's settling down, you guys, that was so awesome.

I'm I love you all so much.

Hey, there's there's a look at the table, everybody, there's a bunch of dishes here.

1:19:17

That would be a lot of work and would, would everybody be willing, please to take your dish over right now and give it a quick rinse and throw it in the dishwasher?

That would just be amazing.

Let's just do that all together like, yeah, boom, let's do it and we all go over and take care of it and it's quick and done and there's no fighting.

1:19:36

There's no dictatorship.

There's no I'm the boss here, and you don't have to ruin a perfectly good moment.

And, and I know some people listening are probably like, well, that's not going to work.

Like that approach, that's just not going to work.

And there is this level where if it's sincere, meaning that, and this is difficult because there is a nuance here.

1:20:00

I have to be willing ultimately, because I'm the adult and I'm responsible to do all the work myself if I have to.

Because that's what responsible adults do, right?

And I know that this shift in me made a huge difference in the shift in my family when I was willing to do the work instead of complain and whine and be the martyr.

1:20:23

I just said, you know what?

I want this done.

And so if I have to, I will do it myself.

That willingness also then made it more welcoming or open for people to want to contribute because they saw it now as like, I'm helping, I'm serving, I'm contributing to my mother who is actually willing to do it herself now.

1:20:47

This is very different than like, I never asked for help.

I never explain how others can contribute.

I have to do everything.

I have to do everything I'm going to do.

Passive aggressive, Yeah, I guess I'll just do it all myself.

Yes, it's a very, very different attitude, but ultimately it comes from an inner way of being that approaches it with, you know what?

1:21:10

I am willing to do this because I do want them.

Because that's another thing that's difficult for moms, too.

They don't understand that their family doesn't want the same things they want.

They think my husband and my kids, they all want the dishes clean and the kitchen clean up, but they're just too lazy to do it.

1:21:26

They don't.

They don't realize that their husband and kids don't care about it as much as they do because they're willing and ready to go off and do other things, and when they need to, they'll come back and clean up the kitchen.

It doesn't have to be clean right now, right?

It's simply a different way of thinking that most moms I think believe to be just some sort of defect in.

1:21:49

There same with dads too, where dads might see kids doing something and the dad thinks, well the only reason they would do that is if they're lazy or spoiled.

So if my way of thinking, if they don't, if they don't value it as much as I do, then there's only one option.

They're lazy and spoiled and entitled.

1:22:06

And so I need to go be the boss, the dictator and tell them that they're lazy and spoiled in a tile and you scream at them.

So they're not doing that anymore.

And we all know that doesn't work and the dad lecturer is lame and doesn't work.

And so it's part of getting on the same page is realizing that our spouse and our children think differently.

1:22:26

Do their brains literally operate differently?

They see different things, They notice different things.

Yep.

And so you can't come to this erroneous conclusion that they think like you.

And so if they're not doing what you think they should be doing, then they must be XYZ.

That's not true.

Exactly.

And so we have to put this on the table.

1:22:43

We have to discuss these things, go through the core philosophy, go through specific instances.

Like screen times, like, you know, dishes, like chores go through.

Well, even yelling like I, I know some couples that one of one of the parents yells and screams and the other one hates.

1:23:05

It's so bad.

So talk through that.

Be like, hey, how can, what can I do to help you?

So you're not yelling at the kids because yelling at the kids like it's not helping and they know that and they feel bad about it.

And so you're like, what can we do?

How can we do it differently?

And we often they're yelling because they don't know what else to do.

1:23:22

They just want the kids to respond and they aren't, so they yell.

So like, OK, let's strategize.

Let's come up with better strategies and tactics, which is why Rachel and I created our own course Tools and Tactics that actually work.

Like, let's get the tools that work so we don't have to use screaming and yelling and insulting and name calling and threatening as our only and last resort.

1:23:47

Right, exactly.

And then, you know, most importantly, the primary focus of this is to be more united, to have more clarity.

And that includes talking through it about why we want the things that we want, so that we can respect each other, we can back each other up, we can support our differences, but from a place of unity rather than confusion.

1:24:14

Implementation, Rachel and I would, we'd talk about what is it?

What's the ultimate thing we want?

OK, we want our kids to do this.

How does what does that look like on a day-to-day?

Well, it looks like this.

OK, good.

We we agree on that.

So how are we going to do implementation?

How are we going to force this?

And that's where it might be different because we're going to be different people and that's OK.

1:24:33

But but we're right.

We're unified.

We both want the same thing.

We're we won't want this standard for our kids.

We're going to teach them.

You teach like a mom.

I'm going to teach like a dad.

We're going to support each other.

And we're going to move forward towards that thing.

Now we're on the same page.

1:24:49

Yeah.

Or at least in the same book.

And we can, we can help each other.

And then it feels fantastic.

Right.

But we have to, and I know that we say this a lot, but we have to emphasize this again and again and again because as I have a reminder on my phone that goes off every day, nothing gets better until I do.

1:25:08

Ultimately, this is a journey of individual, personal development.

We have to get better as people.

Because even as you were talking through some of these scenarios of yelling and defensiveness and rules, ultimately that's all an inner journey.

1:25:24

That's all an inner problem, right?

You know, there's uncomfortable truths in this parenting journey, and one of them is unfortunately, that you are the problem.

You're the problem.

It's not your kids, it's not your spouse.

1:25:42

You are the one that needs to change.

Now, obviously nobody's perfect, and they also need to change as well.

But when we focus on changing ourselves first, that's where the magic is.

That's when we create real change.

Right, that's when the change actually occurs.

In in a very real way, it's not that our children are acting like children, it's that parents.

1:26:03

Are acting like children, it's true.

Say hey, it's it's time for you to grow up.

And.

Be the adult in the room and in the family, and to own it, to take full responsibility for the outcomes, to take total ownership of your children's behavior.

1:26:21

Because they're your fault.

Acknowledging like well I just haven't taught them well enough.

Immediately you're like, I've told them 10,000 times they know.

Like both to know and not to do is really not to know exactly.

They're not doing.

They don't know.

1:26:36

So they don't know, which means you told them, but you didn't teach.

Them right and you didn't probably didn't model it.

Exactly.

And so they're most often, more often than not, what kids are doing is modeling something you've done, they picked it up.

1:26:55

They're imitating it.

Imitate it so it's imitation without regulation.

They're exaggerating it.

Yep.

So they notice something you do and now they're going to take their little variant on it and and apply it with their siblings or apply it to their temper tantrums because they'll often throw a tantrum because they've been watching you throw adult tantrums.

1:27:14

And they're like, oh, I know how to behave when I get upset, when I don't get my way, when I don't like what someone's done.

I saw my mommy do that or I saw dad.

Dad does it every day when he comes home.

I know exactly what to do when I'm upset.

And they do their own little variation of it.

And and when you realize that as a parent, you're like, oh, if I want to create change, I change myself because I'm the problem.

1:27:35

Exactly.

And so that means you're the solution.

That's good news.

Yeah, right.

That is the good news.

You are the solution in many ways.

It's honestly never been easier to become a great parent because there's more resources out there than there's ever been in the history of the world.

I mean, it used to be you only just in some ways it was a positive.

1:27:53

You had your extended family to rely on, your grandma, your mother to give you advice and guidance because they'd walk the path.

They've done the journey and.

Or they're passing along.

Well, I mean that that's generational disadvantage as well.

But I'm saying in some ways it was an advantage because you weren't just trying to figure it out on your own like so many nuclear families are today.

1:28:17

But the benefit we do have of today's world is that we have access to so many resources.

One of course is the is our course that we just created which are highly.

Parent mentoring method.

Yeah.

I would highly encourage you to click the link in the show notes it the enrollment opens and closes.

1:28:34

So I would get on the waiting list so that when it does open again, because we're doing in court cohorts according to age, the age of your children, so that we can really focus on those ages anyways, get on the waiting list.

So when it opens up again, you can get into one of the cohorts.

1:28:50

But there are resources out there to have. 11 little caveat to that is that there's a lot of really crappy resources out there too.

There's a lot of garbage from.

Which is why.

These parents who had one or two kids and send them off like they outsourced them the whole time and then they're like, I'm going to book.

1:29:10

Parent.

Parenting.

You're like, well, you didn't even raise your kids.

Yeah, but yeah, but they're very obedient.

Like, well, I don't want obedient kids.

Yeah, that's true.

There is actually a lot of advice out there that is in many ways harmful to children, which is one of the reasons we've created our course because there are better ways to do things and you know, that's what we're sharing.

1:29:33

And of course, we do have our free guides, the free six step guide on how we raise seven well adjusted kids while traveling to 60 plus countries.

And we have the checklist, which is everything what we do every day to raise our seven.

Well, just.

1:29:48

So what I did, somebody asked like, I want specific steps and I sat down.

I thought, you know, what are the things we've been doing now for years?

Like what?

What are our non negotiables?

Like we do this stuff religiously.

And I made that list.

Yeah.

So this is a checklist of what we've been doing for 22 years with phenomenal results, not just in our own family and with all of our different kids and all their struggles.

1:30:12

These things we share with our clients and that they've implemented with their families to get amazing results, total transformations in their families.

And that list is absolutely gold.

And it's absolutely.

Free, right?

And I think it's so important for people to understand those who don't know it's, we don't just have lucky kids.

1:30:29

We weren't just born, we didn't just get the kid lottery, right, You know, because we've got ADHD, we've got learning disabilities, we have adopted and birthed kids.

So we've got a whole mix in there.

And so these are things that work because they work, not because we're just lucky.

Yeah, OK.

1:30:45

It's the equation.

It just works math problem.

Like you do, you follow the formula and it works.

Even if you have to include the X factors for your children.

Well, there's all kinds of every kid has a factor, right?

You're.

Like, well, that's OK.

Well.

It works for that kid.

No, I got to change it up for this kid and that's that's.

1:31:01

Part of the critical math equation.

Yeah, love it.

OK, so have a conversation this week if you can, as soon as you can, and multiple conversations.

To lean into the discomfort, be willing to bring it up even if you're afraid, even if you know they won't handle it well, whatever.

Like, be willing to move into that space because the obstacle is the way.

1:31:19

On the other side of that conversation, is the solution getting you closer to the solution you want.

And and approach it tactfully.

Don't be like we need to talk about your problem.

You're terrible.

Just say, hey, let's, let's talk about our differences in strategy here.

1:31:35

Let's settle on the table and let's just examine them and see if we can come up with a way that we both agree on that works for both of us, that we complement each other instead of compete against each other.

OK.

Love you guys.

Reach upward.