#295 Refuse to Participate in the Destruction of YOUR Family

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the extraordinary family life podcast for your host, Greg and Rachel Denning. Today we are responding to some great questions and comments that came in on a reel that Rachel shared about not participating in the institutions that are destroying family. really, you guys know this, if you've been listening off, you're new. Like we just highly advocate being.

unconventional, nonconformist, and not participating in tribal functions that are anti-family. Like, take back control of your life, your work, and your education. Well, OK, because you said we're highly...

I don't even remember what you said, but something about unconventional, non-conformist. And I would say in some ways we're not actually. I think in some ways we're very traditional. Ultimately, we are very family-focused. We truly believe that the way to improve the world, the way to save the world, the way to be happy,

is found in individual development and then family development, right? So it starts with the individual and then it spreads out from there to the marriage relationship. You must have a long-term intimate relationship. And then it spreads out to the family. if, and I'm gonna say this, if all humans focused on those things in that order, the world would be a better place. Like hands down,

Greg & Rachel Denning (03:05.624)
That's just true. From everything I've studied from psychology to history to sociology, fill in the blank, that is the foundation of a healthy, healthy individuals and a healthy society. So at times, that priority does look like nonconformity.

it does look like being unconventional because ultimately our focus is on not just doing the things that you're supposed to do and following the formulas you're supposed to follow. Yeah, follow them if they work and lead to those end goals. But if they don't, you have to do something unconventional. You have to do something different so that you can get those primary goals, so you can achieve those primary goals. Right. And along the way, that may look like to some people, it may look selfish.

It's like, hey, what in the world? Who do you think you are? You're just going to abandon society? You're just going to abandon community because you want to be happy? That's really selfish. Well, let's get into the real, I guess, and then some of the comments. And because we thought that this was important and relevant to discuss on our Extraordinary Family Life podcast, because I think that it is, well, I don't think. I know it is a key ingredient or a key.

foundational piece for creating an extraordinary family. Like you have to be willing to take some of these unconventional steps if it's right for your family to...

create the higher level, more extraordinary family life that you're after. It is just a part of what has to be done, I think. and 100%, I think right out the gate here, we'll just say, I wholeheartedly believe that that's actually better for community. The world desperately needs individuals and families who are healthy and strong and...

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solid and dependable and lit up who are pursuing passion and doing work they love and doing it so well. Instead of just robotic zombie, I'm checking the boxes and conforming for the good of society. I'm being responsible just to be responsible. Yeah, that's crazy. we would even...

Recommend that people sacrifice their well-being and I know for the quote and it of the community right and I don't want this to be construed in the wrong way because we're not promoting the idea of being selfish or being Self-centered or not serving or not Doing good in the world. That's not what we're saying But what we are saying what we do believe in what we do live by is that when you focus on

genuine, authentic self-improvement that that's actually how you become more capable of being a force for good in the world. Like you really don't have... you have more to offer. You don't have the ability to really be a good person in the world if you don't do that. And in fact, one of the main challenges you face with your coaching clients, I think, is people who out of the best intentions, out of the goodness of their heart,

they are, what we say, neglecting their families so that they can do good in the world. They're out serving other people at church or in the community or here or there or everywhere. Meanwhile, their family life is falling apart. Their marriage is struggling. Their kids don't listen, depressed, anxious, know, threatening suicide. Like this is the stuff you deal with on a daily basis and your message to them constantly is, forget all of that. Stop going out and trying to do good in the world.

come home and do good in your family. That's the type of selfishness we're talking about because when you do that, you as an individual and your family become stronger, better, more capable to then actually be a force for good in the world. That is the foundation of everything we live by and teach and believe. And our ability to do any good in the world, if we are doing any, is based off that. We started by focusing on ourselves.

Greg & Rachel Denning (07:26.978)
You focused on you, I focused on me, then we focused on our marriage, and then we focused on our children. That's where we started. And that's built a solid foundation that makes it possible for us to then be, and I'm using specifically this phrase, know, because it means a lot to us, a great force for good in the world. And we have the opportunity and privilege to honestly do good almost daily. Right. Like we're engaged, because we're philanthropists at heart.

But it all started and we've heard this many times over the years is like when you pursue personal development and self-improvement, some people say, that's selfish. You're being selfish. You're spending more time on yourself. people say that to us even recently. I'm like, wait a minute. If I just am like, I'm just going to give all my time and effort and I'm just giving to give, give, give, give, give. And obviously you can't do that. It's impossible. so it's like, but it's this idea we have like, no, I need to spend my time with others. Like, what do you have to offer?

You have very little knowledge, very little, very few skills. You hardly even understand humanity or yourself. You don't understand psychology. You don't understand the sexes. hardly, like what are you offering? There's not much of you. And so this quote selfish approach to work harder on yourself than you do on anything else enables you to then have something of

real value to offer and you can do more more good exponentially by, like you're saying, focusing on yourself and on your family so that you're solid and dependable and capable to do good. exactly. Okay, so I'm gonna read the reel and then we're gonna read some of the comments that we received. It was essentially a voiceover that I, you know, I just put a bunch of clips of our family.

It was... I just found it on Instagram. I mean, it's just another trending audio and I thought, sweet, I'm gonna use this. So it starts by saying, refuse to participate in the agenda to destroy the family unit. Yes! It's not normal for families to wake up each morning rushing out the door. Sorry, I have to wait for it to go. Heading in separate directions. Parents to work, kids to school.

Greg & Rachel Denning (09:53.124)
It's not normal for kids to spend the majority of their waking hours with strangers. Now already, people are like, what do you mean it's not normal? That is normal. That's most normal thing in the world. society. And if we haven't traveled extensively, you just might think, well, that's what everybody does. That's what the whole world does. They don't know any different. Right. Or if you haven't studied history and realized that that's an industrial age concept.

normal way of living that we understand only started to occur with the industrial age. Like factories and people going to work and moving to the cities. What would you say, 150, 200 years maybe? Yeah, maybe. Maybe not even that much. So before that, we were like agricultural farming communities and we all lived at home. We all worked together. We all spent the day together. You know, that's how the world was.

So when we think, well this is normal, this is what it's like, we don't understand that, it's only normal for us in our, you know, few generations, but still it's fairly new comparatively to the rest of human existence, right? Okay. So spending time with strangers, being shaped by values and ideas that don't align with their families. That right there I think is the epitome of the whole argument. Yes.

And there's a counter argument to that because, you know, there is, of course, the necessity to be exposed to outside ideas, outside opinions, outside values. There is value in that. It's necessary because there is danger to that viewpoint. If you never were exposed and you were completely isolated, that's also dangerous. So that, you know, that's of course why people think it's not a good thing. It continues. It's not normal to work tirelessly day after day until you're 65.

Greg & Rachel Denning (11:53.912)
just so you can retire too late to fully enjoy the life you sacrificed so much for.

Sorry, I have to wait for it to go. This agenda pushes us into lives of disconnection. Parents too exhausted from work to spend meaningful time with their children. Children growing up without the guidance and influence of their own family, shaped instead by institutions that condition conformity. It actually went on, but that was all I used in my reel. And it's doing well.

viral reel that's doing well with lots and lots of comments. So, and you have been responding to some of the comments on there. And I think... Because sometimes on some of our reels people are just mean. really are. This is stupid, this is horrible, you guys are idiots, you're destroying society. guys... child abuse, should... your children should be taken away from you, you know, I mean, people can say ridiculous things. on those we just... I just delete them, I'm like, whatever. But then there are people who have legitimate...

Concerns or questions or are sincerely wondering well wait, what about this? What about this counter viewpoint? Yeah, and that's awesome. That's a great thing. So I'm gonna read I think it's a thread that you had here. I'll start with the first one But who builds the roads we drive on who becomes policemen What about the nurse and her 12-hour shift if we all just did remote work then our society wouldn't work And those are real important and honorable jobs

So, and I guess I want to go through and kind of respond to these ideas. And I'm glad this person brought it up and said, hey, well, wait a minute, what about that? Because then it provides us all this opportunity to start thinking through this idea. So those of you who listening, I hope you're thinking about what you're doing with your family and what you're doing with your career and your work and your kids' education and the work they're going to do and where society is going. And at the same time, you know,

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as we're talking through this, think about your own objections. As I'm reading this reel, the words of this reel, what are you thinking? Well, wait a second, what about this and what about that? And I think we'll probably address some of them in this, and we would love to hear more from you even. honestly saying, well, wait, what about this? How does that apply to this? Because, know, Greg and I live by what this reel was talking about. We truly believe that.

We truly have designed, we've literally been intentional in designing our lives to live this way because we did not start out that way. It's not like we were lucky and we're like, this is great. You and I, we get to stay at home with our kids and homeschool them. That's awesome. No, we had to work really, really hard to make it our reality and it is our reality. Now, if people are new and they don't know, my mom jokes. She's like, I don't know anyone that spends more time together than your family. Like you're basically together.

24-7, 365 days a year. And that's not 100 % true, because we take trips and go away and stuff. we spend every day, most all day long together, at least in the same space. And that's very unique. We work from home. Our kids do school from home. We work on projects together. We spend lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of time together. And we love it.

We serve together and we adventure together exactly right we together. We you know and so we do all these things together But it didn't just happen that way we didn't just start out that way you had a normal job you went to work every day I Stayed home as soon as we adopted our first And so we spent a lot of time apart originally because that was that's what's normal right like people are saying That's the normal thing and so we started out living a very normal

life and we only have the life we do now that also has included traveling to for me 60 countries with our kids we had to make it happen we had to work hard to make it happen because it's normal right that's the unconventional part that's the non-conformist part it's not normal but we believe what this reel says because firsthand experience we know it's created a stronger better

Greg & Rachel Denning (16:26.402)
happier family unit than we would have otherwise. Absolutely. Right? Okay. obviously people start wondering, okay, well, not everyone can just travel and not everyone can work online, which is part of the argument, You can't just all do virtual work, which is obviously true. Yeah. And I guess when we're sharing ideas, especially kind of unconventional ideas.

We're really talking to a small group of people who are even willing to think differently, to live differently, to question things and who are capable of or want to become capable. And I don't want this to sound rude or mean, but traveling extensively to dozens of countries and working with thousands and thousands of people.

There are a lot of people that just aren't capable of much else, of doing different things, right? They've, for whatever reason, and there's lots of reasons, but for whatever reason, there's a lot of people that just, they're just gonna live a very simple, normal, structured life, they need that. And that's okay. Yep, totally okay. Well, I was...

I don't want to interrupt you if you have to if you want to finish your thought keep going okay I just wanted to mention something I was actually thinking about this morning and to point this out because despite the fact what I just said that we'd love that we live this we believe in this I also firmly believe that there is a place and a necessity for the normal institutions of society like we live here at our world school family resort in Portugal and we have an employee that lives here and works for us

And she has a son that's three. And every day one of us gives her a ride to school, gives him a ride to school with her. And so this morning I took them and I was sitting there waiting for her to drop him off to school and watching all of these families bringing their kids to school and dropping them off. And I thought, this is good. Because for a lot of these people, it's just, including her, it's amazing that she gets to send her kid to school. Like that's a...

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huge benefit and blessing for her. She needs that for herself. She's a single mom. It gives her the opportunity to be able to work while he's at school and it gives him the opportunity to have exposure to other people and other circumstances and to be able to learn and to grow. All of that is necessary and important and I would never say to her you just need to homeschool him and keep him home. Like I wouldn't say that to her because it's not the right situation for her. So

While we're talking about that, we want to be clear that not in a derogatory way, our message isn't for her necessarily. Maybe one day it could be. But that's not the advice I would give her right now. And so we do want to say that. Yeah, we're sharing this. And we're passionate about it. But it is for a certain set of people who are ready to take that on or to live at this.

And I do want to say a higher way of living because it's more work, it's more effort, but it's also more reward. And there are certain people who are ready for that. And that's who this podcast is for. Right. And honestly, it's going to be less than 2 % of people. Yeah. But the same is true for if you're saying, hey, look, we should be in absolutely fantastic shape. We should be working out, exercising, eating, know.

the best quality food we can get, that's also to like less than 2 % of people. And we are all constantly saying, look, you should be reading all the time and listening to books all the time. Now I've averaged a book a week for over two decades. I'm going to promote that like crazy. Read, read, read, listen to books. But guess what? That's also to about less than 2 % of people. And if we do this big post about, you should be reading tons of book, nobody's like, well, what about?

La la la la, whatever. It's like, no, it's the same message. We're promoting this higher way of living. pursuing a world-class education, striving to become wealthy and healthy and genuinely happy and pursuing your unique abilities and making a unique contribution to the world that is transformative for the people within your circle of influence. This is a...

Greg & Rachel Denning (21:15.426)
It's a message that's not for eight billion people. But at the same time, I think it's interesting that there is still a kernel or a principle within that that is true for everybody. Because I think no matter who you are, one of the eight billion people in the world, nobody's going to argue that reading more is better for you. Or learning to read. You know, if you even go back further, learning to read is better than not reading. Or reading more is better than reading less. You know, there's an element there.

where at some point you get to the level of reading a book a week or two books a week is where you should be, you you might not start there with someone who doesn't know how to read, but you're definitely going to say, you know what, learning to read is better than not reading. So there's levels there. And at some point you're like, okay, here's the higher level, read two books a week or read a book every day. You know, I was listening to a book recently and she said during the summertime, she's a teacher. She reads, she tries to read a book a day. Wow. I'm like, wow. Okay.

So, you know, there's all different levels there. I think the same is true with this idea, with this real. It's like, okay, here's a higher level, but none of us are gonna argue and say, well, spending more time together as a family is not good. You know, I don't think anyone would make that argument. But there would be people. Maybe. But that's to be as silly as learning to read isn't.

good for you or something like you know. there's going to be people that say that too. Maybe. Every time of people. There will be some and they're going to argue to those sides and I guess the invitation for all of this is like, think through this. Think through every aspect of your family life and what you're doing and why. And do you want to join the what we call the 1.7 percent club? They found out you know 1.7 percent of people are actively engaged in making their lives better. That means 98.3 percent of people are just existing.

And even right now, if whoever, I don't know, the government did or whatever, I mean, this is totally imaginary because it never happened, even right now, just said to everybody in the United States, said, OK, everybody stop. Just stop. You can do what you want to do. You can choose your career. You can choose your, just do what you want. A percentage of people, which would be a lot, would

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would gravitate to good things and do good things. a majority... Meaning what? Good things. Meaning they would pursue art and music and they'd pick careers like, wait a minute, Noah, I genuinely do love nursing. I want to do this. Or being a policeman. I'm gonna go do it. Or... I've never met... I'm related to my brother, my cousins, other relatives, friends, police officers. I've never met a police officer who actually loves it.

know, a couple times they're like, yeah, you know, it's cool, I got to do this and then, you know, and they have those moments like, yeah, I got to like wrestle with dude, I got to take down bad guys, great, but you know, they have some good days, but I don't know anyone's like, yeah, wow, that's very fulfilling and good. So in a way then that argues to this lady's point, because if nobody was quote unquote forced or required to be policemen, then would we have policemen and then would we live in a society that was completely...

dysfunctional and filled with crime because we didn't have anyone enforcing crime or being a judge or you know like Administrating and the government and all those types of things that is kind of the point she's making here is that if we all just worked from home and did what we wanted to do as soon as you say if we all then the arguments off because Not everyone's gonna do it not ever even even can like and some people don't have children and some people aren't married and some people you know, so on and on and on

So immediately, and you and I have said this for a long time, when very first got married, we'd say, babe, let's never argue to extremes because it doesn't do us any good. So as soon as I say an idea, you're like, well, if everybody did that, you're like, well, your statement just becomes So if we take this idea then, and we say, well, then who are we actually talking to? OK, we are talking to.

parents with children and most likely out of necessity Parents who are married with children right because it's going to be a different scenario for Single parents or whatnot, but still but but even within that it would still only necessarily apply potentially to parents who are

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Raising children during the child raising years before and after that It would look different. Does that make sense? Yeah, so so what are we really talking about? We're about while you are actively raising children. This should be Forefront this should be pride the the priority in your life while you're actively raising Especially young children and and we're talking to I think primarily people who want

to maximize their own potential and their kids and they want to live and design their own unique extraordinary family life. People who have the desire to live at a, like this calling, this inner upward reach that we always talk about to be their very best. Not everybody has that. Not everybody even acknowledges it or goes for it.

Not everybody even wants it. would just rather, many people unfortunately, sadly, would just rather acquiesce and settle because, that requires effort. I'm out. I want this simple existence. So we're talking to people who want it and who either have the capability and resources to do it or have the desire to gain the capabilities and resources to do it. And I hope those of you who listening are in that group.

pretty confident you I'm assuming you are. Yeah, you're listening this. But I guess the invitation today is we're kind of, we're inviting you to consider this, to really chew on it. Like which camp are you in, basically? Well, What are you going to do individually?

Our bold declaration to everybody listening is yes, 100 % stop participating in any kind of institutional thing that is anti-family at all. Like stop. Stop, stop, stop. Get away from that stuff. And be deliberate about doing life on your terms. Now as soon as I say that, sounds selfish. But if you do life on your terms and if this small group of people we're talking to,

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truly decides to do life on their terms, they're actually gonna be a greater asset to community and society. A far greater asset than they would be otherwise. And depending on the person, again, because you coach people and it's not like when you're coaching people, you're telling your clients, hey, quit your job and become a life coach like me and work from home, that's the best way to be happy. You've never told anyone that. Nope, and not a single one of my clients ever has. Exactly.

What you are doing with them is working with their unique situation, their unique career about how can you optimize this so that you can maximize time with spouse, time with family, and life fulfillment. That's a really great point because, and I always lead with questions. I'm like, what is it you truly want for your marriage, for your children, for your family?

legacy and then we move beyond that for your clients or patients for the community how do you want to make a difference and I always start with questions and and some Have some clarity about what they want many don't they haven't really given enough thought so we spend some time working through that It's like what is it you really truly want and when we clear out all the distractions everything you get to this course like this is what I want and Then it almost immediately they're like, but that seems impossible Like how's that? How's that even?

Likely, what's the point? What's the point of sitting here dreaming about what I really want for my family? Because it just won't work. And then that's where I step in with my unique skill set of like, well, no, this is how we make it work. It's totally doable. Initially, it might seem like it won't work out. But then, no, there's absolutely a way to make that a reality. And so that's what we're doing. And that's kind of the invitation I'm making to you is like, what is it you truly want? Then let's figure out ways to make it happen. And if it's done well, I

I just have to shout this from the rooftops here. If it's done well, it's not detrimental to community at all. In fact, it's the opposite. You're better, happier, healthier. Your children, your marriage and your children, your family is better, happier, healthier. And you all now have this overflowing of strength and goodness to spread through community.

Greg & Rachel Denning (30:30.572)
It's better for the community if we're all happier, healthier, and doing work we love, and doing it really well because we love it. So in that framework, one level of this is, OK, you work from home. Your children are homeschooled. You're together all the time. Great. But there are also varying degrees, varying levels where you could go from wherever you are. doesn't matter what. You spend no time together currently.

You can go from there and there is a way to be strategic to improve and increase the amount of time you spend together. That's kind of the point behind this, I think, right? Where people who are listening are asking themselves, great guys, you threw out this reel and it's talking about being together all the time. But that's not realistic. But we're saying what is realistic is you can...

raise let's call it a thermostat you can raise your thermostat you can change the thermostat so that you can get a different outcome in from what you currently have instead of which too many people do just acquiescing and saying oh it's not possible this is normal like oh well we should get to this other question where she says something like you know i have to send my children to these institutions or i have to well it's she basically says that

The way society functions is we're all forced to send our kids to institutions so that they learn how to function, which that whole idea just... Okay, but you did point out for some people who literally have no other resources and would get no other education otherwise, then yes. But that's like...

That's for the people that are near the bottom of the socioeconomic ladder. They have no other resources. So that's what it's for. It's to prevent something much worse, which is total ignorance and absolute poverty. And as you move up that ladder, the natural inclination is to find different.

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methods, different ways, different approaches, different resources. Like that's just natural. There's so many now. There's so many other great resources. So I think that's a good thing to say. I know this is going to, it sounds harsh. It sounds hard. It's unfortunate and we want to have it be different. But the way things are in the world right now, we have bare minimum resources that are available to people who have no other options.

So this podcast, this message isn't for those people. Like they have no other option to take. maybe it's holding up a ideal. An ideal like hey, you can get there. at some point. Because I'm actually reading this really great book called The Formula. It's like the success to raising highly, the secret to raising highly successful children. And it's mostly talking about achieving academic success, you know, or whatever. But.

It has great principles and that one of the things they talk about in the formula is that every one of these parents were very, very strategic. And they're talking about parents even that are living, literally one woman was living in a homeless shelter with her son. And she had a vision though of what she wanted for his life. And she held that up even though it seemed so impossible. She had that vision and she was just very strategic and very intentional about

I'm gonna do these things, I'm gonna read to him, I'm gonna teach him these things, I'm gonna get him into the right schools, I'm gonna, like she was very strategic about following a certain path to achieve a high ideal outcome. Perfect. So she and like Ben Carson's mom, like Ben Carson's mom couldn't even read and she insisted that her boys read every day. Like, Voracy, because she went and cleaned houses for these super wealthy people and what'd she find in every house? Libraries.

So she's like, well, okay, if this is what happened, then my boys are doing that. And he became a renowned brain surgeon. But she was clear about it. So you're right. It can fit anywhere because what we're saying is like, no, you do things differently. And so she did things differently for her boys. She said, no, you're not going to participate in that stuff. Yeah, you'll go to school, but then you're going to come home. And instead of, you know, watching TV or whatever, you're going to read books and you're to blah, blah, blah, blah. She had this path laid out so they could get a world-class education and wealth.

Greg & Rachel Denning (35:10.256)
Right. So you're right. It's we're pointing this out now. I guarantee there's some people saying, OK, well, this is just such a privileged podcast. And because you and I happen to be white, it might just come across as a white privileged podcast. And I think it's important to point out that you and I both grew up grew up in in in families that struggled financially. My family was on welfare.

We were to food stamps as a kid you and I were on welfare at a point Yeah, we were absolutely broke and we went through the school system then I went to college to get the degree I was following the conveyor belt path and You know, we went along that I was out on my own as a teen like we we were broke and ignorant and didn't have any I didn't know any of this stuff

But I started reading voraciously and the more you read, the more you get education, the more you get exposure, the more you realize what's available. And then once you realize there's more available, my invitation to everybody listening is like, learn what's available and start choosing. Yes. Choose from the options instead of feeling like I have no option. I have to do this. Well, and this is a very important point here of choosing because, you might see this ideal and be like, there's no way.

I could homeschool my children and we could work from home. Like it's not even possible or even close to possible. But what you can do is make a choice that brings you a little bit closer to what that ideal represents. If it represents more time as a family, if it represents being more strategic in your family relationships or in your child's education, then that's what you do. You make a step.

that gets you one step closer to that ideal. And that's the point, really. So maybe you're in a situation right now, you're there's no way we could homeschool and travel the world. You can become more strategic. And I guess what I'm saying is, maybe the desire is there. You're like, actually, if I could, I would. And if that thought is there, if that desire is there, that's fantastic. Because then you do what you're saying, Rachel, is you start taking steps in that direction.

Greg & Rachel Denning (37:22.296)
Right? If you're sitting here in a situation like, man, I would love to have a location independent income. I would love to do work that I love to do. I know there's probably a lot of people listening who don't like their work. They genuinely don't like what they do. And you're like, well, that would be nice to do. love it. That's just a pipe dream. That's not realistic. People don't get to do what they love. That's not true. There are a lot of people who get to do what they love and you can be one of them. Right. So could you you quit your job today? No. But could you start?

Cultivating the skill set to move into a career that you love 100 % Yeah, yes, maybe you're not in a spot where you could you you want to home educate But you you couldn't do it right now. So maybe you could do it next year well, and then even if you Think it's something you would never do you can still be more strategic in being involved with your child's education Just like Ben Carson's mom in this example

she worked she was a single mom she sent her kids to school but she was very strategic in making sure they got the right opportunities they got the right exposure they had the right habits that gave them an advantage when it came to academic success and that's what this book was all about specifically she took total ownership like absolute ownership and responsibility of their education even though she was completely illiterate how amazing is that

That so cool. So we can all do that and move towards that. I think we have an ethical responsibility, a moral obligation to do that, to make the most of ourselves and to help our children do the same. So we don't have to participate. First of all, we don't need these outside institutions to make sure our kids can function in society. That's not the case. And we don't have to go.

do work this miserable. are actively involved in teaching ourselves. I think the problem here is that

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Parents, they need those institutions because they're not doing the job. It's almost like, and this is the worry I think of many people because it is true for a lot of people, if they took the kids out of the institutions, nobody's doing the job now. And so what we're saying is, you don't need the institutions as long as you are willing to do the work to then pass it on. And for some people, some parents, they don't want to do that work, which is why they use the institutions.

And if you're not going to do the work and if you're not going to step up, then yeah, you should definitely use institutions. it's your safety net, but it's the bare minimum. I want to point that out again. It's the bare minimum. And if you're going to be like, well, if you're willing and maybe today this podcast is that step where you acknowledge, okay, that's the bare minimum. Even, okay, I got to throw this down here.

So your kid goes and gets good grades, whatever, and even goes to college. In my mind, going to college and getting a degree is still a bare minimum. That is not the standard of excellence. Yeah, because you come away with like $100,000 plus more of debt. you can only get a job that makes like $40,000 a year. And This was the statistics I just saw recently. Very, very basic education. A university education is not a world-class education. Right. It is now. It's more like indoctrination than education.

But even if it was a good one, it's still that's not like I've been educated. No, like that's the bare minimum. That's the beginning. The foundation. It's just the beginning. And that's my point, I guess. So if you're willing to just settle for a bare minimum, OK, but just at least acknowledge that's what you're doing. so then you come back, you're like, well, who's going to be the police officers and the nurses and who's going to build the roads? Well, it's people who

quite honestly, many of them end up there from poor choices or from not choosing a different path. In some cases, a higher path. I've spoken with so many people. like, hey, why did you go down that path? like, I didn't read the books. I didn't get the skills. I didn't put in the work. I didn't put in the effort to pursue something else. So I just.

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what I could. Right? And they admit that of their own. why did you, did you, would you choose this? Is this your dream lifestyle? Your dream career? No way. Why are you doing it? I was desperate. And so desperation leads there. And often people who make bad choices, not like they do bad things, but then they make poor choices, they burn their own bridges and

close their own doors. That's the reality of it. And this isn't to like belittle those professions or minimize their importance because they definitely have a necessity and a place in society. That's why we're having this conversation. And for some people that is exactly what they want to do. And that's great. But I think those people are rare. I would love that actually. In fact, OK, I have a friend who is a civil engineer and he builds roads.

And he crazy loves it. That is the career he chose. went, I he just grinded his way through university to become a civil engineer. He's become very successful. That guy builds roads. And the reason he builds roads is because he loves it. He absolutely loves it. So there it is. Bam. And there is, like, I'm going to be honest. There is an idealistic part of me that truly believes that if every person, because we're all so different, pursued the thing that they loved, the

There would be. Every role in society would be fulfilled. But it would, I also believe though it would be fulfilled in a way that was more optimized so that we, there would be less waste. There would be less busy work. There would be less like just you're there to fill a spot, like a body to fill a chair. There would be less of that because There drudgery and misery. Yeah, exactly. Because people would be excited and engaged and like really into it.

and they would find the ways to do it in the best way and in the most efficient way. I'm an idealist and I believe that that actually could be a reality if we all were true and honest with ourselves about what we wanted and what we loved and at the same time we're willing to fill roles in society that were necessary but according to our own passions and interests. I believe that that's true. that when I was an educator. I worked in private sector and in public and I remember you go in the teacher's lounge

Greg & Rachel Denning (44:16.988)
and most of the teachers were just bickering and complaining. They hated the children. They hated their job. They couldn't wait till the end of the day. They couldn't wait till the end of week and they couldn't wait. I mean, they would constantly be talking. They had 20 years left still and they're like, I can't wait to retire and be done. I hate these kids. I hate this. And that was the conversation every day in the faculty lounge. I'm like, But then there were some that are like, I love teaching.

I love these children, love these youth, I love my subject, like this is amazing, we're changing lives. And they were so good. They were so good and they're impacting lives and students loved it. That's the difference we're talking about. It's the one who chooses it. And I've had conversations with them like, wait, why did you become a teacher if you hate children and you hate the subject? Like, well, I didn't know what else to do, so I just, you know, I thought I could get a teaching certificate and do that.

And so it's by people making those choices. I guess what you mean by bad choices, because our definition of a bad choice is a choice that's not truly aligned with your own intuition, for lack of a better phrase. And your own desires and your own achievement, your own potential. How often do people, they have this inner knowing, this inner calling of like, I could do this and they're like, ugh.

I'll just take this instead. You're like, wait, did you choose that? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'll choose this. I want this. Only because they didn't take the harder choice. of the harder path, the harder road. And in some ways, this is kind of what this is about because the words from this reel, and I don't even know where they came from. It's just some guy on Instagram. But they're true. And they also are more work. Like this ideal went, a guy like this, and I know from experience because this is...

this is how we live, when you choose to pursue a path that has you working from home and building a business in our case, or homeschooling your children, that is not less work. That is more work. That is more effort. That is more responsibility. That is more that is required from you. Like you have to grow and develop into a different, better person in order to even live that kind of life.

Greg & Rachel Denning (46:39.47)
So it's not the easy road, it's not the easy path. It's a harder path. Which makes it laughable that it seems selfish. In some ways, truly believe because we have had people tell us they don't choose that path because it is harder. It's more work and it's easier to just be comfortable and like send your kids to school and then they come home and they do your homework and you get to live your little life doing whatever it is you do.

even if you're going to your job that's not that challenging even though you don't really like it, that's an easier life. Even though people will say to us, well, I would really like this, but how? Well, the answer is it's more work. It's more responsibility that you have to be willing to take on and to develop yourself so that you're capable enough of taking it on and doing it well.

Rather than, because you're right, you're giving up the safety net. And so there's more risk there as well. That's good. Yeah. Yeah. Again, like I said, it makes it laughable to be called selfish. Like, no, this is like self-inflicted. Well, let me read. Struggle. It's so hard. Let me read some more of these comments. OK. One more thought, though. want to share before I lose it. Is thinking is one of the hardest things to do in life. Real, true thinking. is so difficult, so challenging.

Most people don't really think they just repeat the same thoughts they... Right. It's just... It's repeated from yesterday. it's challenging. It's difficult. And our oldest son who's out, he's living in Spain right now. And he's just every single day, he's out serving and teaching and working with tons of people. He just said, people don't know how to think. And these are these people he's working with closely.

And he just pointed out, he's like, you know, they go through the whole educational system and they get the good grades, whatever, they check all the boxes. He's like, but they have no idea how to have an engaging conversation. They don't know how to think through ideas and philosophies. They don't even know how to discuss it and wrap their heads around. It's like nothing. So they went through and they got, you know, quote, educated. Really what happens, they got schooled. then to what end? Right.

Greg & Rachel Denning (48:58.692)
And back to what we said earlier, to what end? It's like, well, that's the bare minimum. So yeah, you want that. We all want to have at least the bare minimum. But the invitation here is to build on top of that much, much more. Yes. OK, so basically, the comment I read, you responded something like, this message is for, we'll use the 1.7 % in this scenario. It says, OK, that's a good point.

And I think the idea of it is great, but the problem is the way it's communicated. Whether intentional or unintentional, it's communicating that if you don't homeschool and run a business from home to be with your kids, that you're participating in the agenda to destroy the family unit. And that's the part that feels unfair, even to those who love the idea of this lifestyle. And to your point, it's normal because the society in the modern world system requires people work outside of the home.

and send their kids to institutions to learn to function. It's a privilege to live this way in Western society at least.

guess my question for everybody listening is just an honest one. Are you actively directing your own life? Are you choosing the harder path for you and for your family, for your children? If not, then by default

What are you choosing? Right. So it's not like a judgment of anyone. It's like just an honest question. Well, are you choosing to direct your own education? Well, Well, And people say, well, yeah, I'm going to school. Or I'm my kids to a school. Yeah, we moved to a good school. OK. But you're still participating. And unless we choose to opt out for better things, harder things,

Greg & Rachel Denning (51:00.76)
then by default we're choosing to opt in. So yeah, we are participating. Or in this scenario, because I think there's a big difference between a person who just sends their child to school and a person who still is actively involved in the school, in the child's education. So they're checking up on them, they're asking them if they learned, they're having discussions with them about what happened during the day. That is a very...

much more strategic and intentional approach than just, well yeah, I'm sending my kids to school and I check their grades, they're good, we're done. That to me is the difference here. You can live this ideal without actually living it just the same as we're living it, for example. You can be involved, you can be strategic, you can be intentional and still send them to the institution. You know what mean? And you can choose different options now. There's so many private...

Options so so many school aspects of it and there's you know part-time and there's you can really creative with it no mix, but I guess I want to emphasize there are so many private Style academies schools, etc that you don't have to just go to government school. Well, it's not the only option Yes, and I also believe that the most important aspect of this and this is part of the key to this is

whether or not it is working for your child and each child's gonna be different. know, if you're doing this and it's just not working and your kid is not thriving, then you have to be willing to make the sacrifices to do something different. Like to me, hands down, that's it. That's not optional for me. I have to be willing to make the sacrifices, including in my own lifestyle, that are necessary to help my child thrive during the child...

rearing ages. So if I'm sending them to school and I'm checking in and I'm being strategic and it's going well, great. If I'm doing that and it's not going well, I have to do something different. I have, and you and I have said this many times, you know, when we first got married and this was before, this is still when we were undereducated and underexposed to the world. But we had this philosophy that we called the Mount Kilimanjaro philosophy. And we said, we will be willing to do, I think this was before we even had kids, like we'll do whatever it takes. Like if our kids are struggling,

Greg & Rachel Denning (53:24.45)
We'll pick up and we'll move to Mount Kilimanjaro, you know, and live there if we have to. And it was just this philosophy that meant to us essentially we're willing to do whatever it takes to make any sacrifices required. Now it's funny because last year we went to Mount Kilimanjaro and two of our teens summoned it.

And you you could never actually live on Mount Kilimanjaro, of course, but the idea is... Man, but to live in the villages on the foothills, it was pretty epic. Where you stayed was really nice. At the all-inclusive resort, that was nice, yes. But you know, but the principle is the same. And that's what we've lived by. We've always been willing to make whatever sacrifice is necessary in order to achieve the desired outcomes we want with our children. And to have really high...

desired outcomes. I hope nobody listening will be like, you know, I'm okay with just settling for the bare minimum. I you think, no, I want so much more. Okay, what do I have to do to get that? And I get what she's saying. It's like, seems so unfair. Well, it only seems unfair if maybe you don't know, you don't yet know how to do it or you feel like you can't.

Or you feel like you're here and you'll never get to there. As opposed to what we were talking about is there's a level where you can take one step closer. You can make a change to move closer to that ideal. And instead of saying, yeah, that would be nice, but I can't do that. And what happens instead of saying, I can't do this, they say things like, well, not everybody can do that. Oh, we're not talking about everybody. We're talking about you. And if you're saying, I can't, my invitation is just ask, well, how could I? Right. How could I do things differently? How could I?

change the educational package arrangement for myself and my children? How could I earn money a different way? Or do a different work? how could I transform my lifestyle? Yeah. It really makes me think of early on in our own journey, in our own life. And for people who have followed us a while, they'll know these stories. there were at least two or three different, let's say,

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forks in the road in our life where we made choices that on the outside looked crazy. You know, they looked absurd. They looked irrational because you you were offered a high paying job earning $100,000 month or more, which was not a month, a year or more, which was a lot for us back then. Or we were going to continue pursuing our own path that would bring us closer to the ideal that we had of working from home and traveling the world.

Right? We held that ideal out there. Like we just had this ideal. We want to be able to travel full time as a family. So we are going to pursue any path that gets us closer to that. And so if something, if when you got offered these jobs that were earning good money, we just looked at them and we said, that would be great, but it does not get us closer to this ideal. I don't know how we're getting to this ideal. We have no clue, but this job is definitely not going to get us there. And so we turned down the jobs.

and pursued something different, whether that was, in one case, it was a position living in India that were thought, okay, at least now we're living in another country like we want. In other cases, it was just working on our own business. And it was hard. That was a real sacrifice. Because instead of having financial security and having that regular paycheck and income, not even to mention when you originally quit your corporate job, you know,

we took a big risk. We were saying no to the steady paycheck and saying yes to the uncertainty of entrepreneurship. And It's been hard. Anyone who knows our story, it was very hard. It was very challenging. There was a lot of sacrifice and work. But it was worth it. That's the point. We made the sacrifices. It wasn't easy. You could have even said it wasn't fair.

Like it wasn't fair that we didn't have that advantage. It wasn't fair that we didn't get to have a clear path laid out for us. We had to struggle and sweat and cry and bleed and want to die sometimes trying to scrape out some sort of existence in the world close to this ideal that we were pursuing. And it's only because we were willing to do that that it's now our reality. That's the only reason. If it had been easy,

Greg & Rachel Denning (57:57.976)
We wouldn't, well, If it was easy, more people would do it. It's because it's not easy that not that many people do it, but that doesn't mean it's not possible. It's totally possible. You just have to be willing to make the sacrifices. And I think as many people as absolutely possible, I would say should make those sacrifices. Should do some form of home education or home sourced education. Should do work they love.

on their own terms and yes, society will still function. All the things will still work out because people will innovate and create and adjust and adapt. AI. Well, that's what I was just going to say. We're moving into this time period now where AI is replacing jobs like crazy already. Just this year from chat GPT, so many jobs have become obsolete from...

meal planners and fitness coaches to like all these agencies for marketing, for writing copy, for... I just heard our oldest daughter talking to our second oldest daughter yesterday, they were facetiming, working on their vision boards and talking about their vision boards together and my oldest daughter was just saying that I don't know the full context but something like she'd come across some guy that was trying to charge for

like a workout plan and she's like, dude, I can get that from chat GPT for free. Like I don't need you. In 30 seconds. She's like, what I need from a person is someone to hold me accountable, someone to motivate me, someone to give me this human aspect. I don't need a plan from you because I can get that on chat, you know? And so I think in some ways, you know, the idealist in me, the idealist in me thinks, you know, all of this AI can be good.

put to a good purpose because we can outsource the things we don't want. And then that gives the human aspect a chance to shine. We can all focus on the things we love and do more of the things that we love so that we can find this, what we're talking about, this fulfillment and this purpose and this meaning in life. I love it. I just wanted to emphasize this because, you know, I was a personal trainer for years and years and years. In order to get your certifications, it's hundreds of hours of study and learning. I mean, there's a lot of work. And then to even...

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be able to get into a gym and build up a clientele. It's just massive. literally, like no exaggeration here, in 30 seconds or less, I can have a full workout plan and a full meal plan for my specific sex, body type, age, and targets. that's what I did for Chet GPT. I told him my age, I told him my weight, my height, my specific medical conditions or whatever, my history, and...

And the focused area, what I was trying to focus on, and it came up with a seven day plan for me. Yeah. Just kicked it out. And so it would be ridiculous for me to now go pursue all those things because I'm competing against a supercomputer that doesn't have to go get the certifications, doesn't have to do anything, can read and scan. But I asked, I asked it the other day.

I said, you know, go through the books of this author and this author and give me an analysis, kind of an emerge of those two philosophies and ideas. And so we can do this project. And I thought, okay, this is going to take it some time. It's got to go through. I mean, for me to go through several books from two different authors, I'm like, that's a lot of time. It was done in.

minute or two and it was spot-on because I've read both of those offers thoroughly and I was like this is unreal like it knew the concepts the ideas used the vocabulary I'm like okay so it's it would be so dumb of us to try to compete against the supercomputer so for for us those of you listening for us as adults and for our kids like don't be sending your kids

down some path that's going to compute with supercomputers. OK, which I think that touches on the crux of this conversation in a way, because what we are saying as idealists here is focus on pursuing your humanness, your connections, your family relationships, your intuition, your personal passions and interests. Focus on those things, because ultimately, as AI continues to improve. And robots.

Greg & Rachel Denning (01:02:48.068)
I know. It's craziness. Who's gonna be making the roads? Robots. Yeah. Who's gonna be policing? Robots, you know. But it's the humanness that's going to separate us and that's going to become more valuable with time. And so in a way, this is part of our natural evolution to become better human beings and a better society and community is by focusing on these very things. Focusing on intimate...

Unique individualized education for each child focusing on spending more time with yourself developing yourself with your spouse developing your Relationships and with your family like all of that is going to become more and more and more important in a world that's becoming more technological and potentially dystopian and

That's ultimately what's going to save us, I think. That's what's going to help us remain or become mentally healthy and physically healthy and to find meaning and purpose in a world that's losing meaning and purpose. That's why I believe it's a higher way. That's why I believe it's a better way because that's what's going to save us in the end. Yes, I love it. Even if it just saves you or your family. Exactly. Even if it just saves you.

So 100%, I think if you even have the desire or you could get the desire capability, educate your children from home. Do work you love. Do it on your own terms. Live where you want to live. Live how you want to live. Figure out the life you want to live, your extraordinary family life, and make it a reality. Right. Just start asking how. And just constantly, just repeatedly ask how. How? How could I do this? How could I do this? How could do this? And you'll get the answers.

And we share the resources all the time. So we do every day. In your coaching program, my coaching program. So we're sharing the resources, the tools, our own experience, our clients' experience. It's totally doable. And we are upfront and forward about the fact that it's not easier. It's not the simple, easy, comfortable path. It's not the one that's going to allow you to sit around and watch Netflix all day. It's not that path.

Greg & Rachel Denning (01:05:12.228)
We want to be clear about that. Now that we also want to be clear that it's absolutely worth the effort. It's a way better path. It's a better path because of the results you get. It's a better path because of the outcomes you have. It's not a quote unquote better path because it's easier. But that's the point of life. Like that's why we're here. We are here to struggle. And I use that word intentionally because when you choose to take on challenges, it's a struggle.

That is how you grow. That's how you develop. That's how you become a better, stronger, more capable person. You have to have that struggle. You can't peel the chick out of the egg, you know, and then hope it lives. It won't. You have to let it struggle to get out of that egg. And then it has the capability of life. It's the same for us. And so we have to be to know that that we're choosing to take on challenge. We're choosing to face that struggle. But that is the point. And that is where

the meaning and the purpose and fulfillment are found. And so it's worth it. It's worth all of that effort. Choose the challenging path, my friends. Exactly. And let us know how we can help. OK. Love you guys. Reach upward.